Sutherland Dam Club
Regular Friday Night Discussion 6:00 PM on Land & Economy
You: Hi
Shaun Altman: Coco :D
Spin Martin: hiya prok
Gonta Maltz: Heyo
Shaun Altman: Hello :D
Frans Charming: Hi Prokofy
Mobile Widget: Hi Prok
Spin Martin: you all famous now
You: Hi let's sit down here I'll rez some benches
You: I was famous before my local shopper covered me Spin : )
Shaun Altman: damn im always in the wrong place lol
Spin Martin: the local shopper haha
Mobile Widget: when was Prok not famous?
Shaun Altman: if i stay down thre, its up
Cocoanut Koala: did i land on you?
Shaun Altman: if i come up here, its down :D
Spin Martin: i'm so calling that 'mass media fic' just so you know
Urizenus Sklar: really prok was famous before sl existed
Mobile Widget: whee
Shaun Altman: no lol its just the event is downstairs today :D
Spin Martin: yeah but not ny times famous
Cocoanut Koala: uri! long time no see!
You: Lordfly
You: OMG
You: and to think the bench won't copy lol
You: oh TD is slow everywhere there it goes
Urizenus Sklar: Prok was quoted in the times in Dec. of 04
Koz Farina: hey i'm wired! woo hoopla!
Cocoanut Koala: am iam i in the wrong lace
Spin Martin: hehe
Rhiannon Chatnoir: heya Koz
Tao Takashi: hey, me, too ;-)
Urizenus Sklar: coco!
You: yes which was outed against my will be evil fucktards putting
it with my TSO name
You: I didn't link my avatars
Lordfly Digeridoo: evil
You: but anyway we're here to talk about GM gomming the land
market
You: 6 sims!
You: did you see?///
Taras Balderdash is Offline
Spin Martin: is there a link?
Taras Balderdash is Online
Khanaar Ingmann: I havent heard much about it myself
Khanaar Ingmann: But I'm here on last minute notice
Lordfly Digeridoo: doesn't sound that horrible to me
You: I just read it on SL Home Page
Shaun Altman: what, EXACTLY, will they do with these 6 sims?
Tao Takashi: Hi Thea :)
Ludo Merit: Six is hardly competition for Anshe.
Lordfly Digeridoo: give it to people for free to do car culture
Amalthea Blanc: hey Tao :)
You: well let me give you the link
You: hagn on
ravagefox Savard: possibly advertisement and product research?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I bert they will be car showrooms.. why not eh
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yeah
You: it doesn't sound like car DESIGN
You: it sounds like CAR CULTURE
You: which could be building a garage
ravagefox Savard: heh
Grace McDunnough: some say design IS culture
Urizenus Sklar: I'm going to make and sell car air fresheners!
Lordfly Digeridoo: what's wrong with car culture?
crucial Armitage: the whole car thing is kool thats really good thing
for SL
Khanaar Ingmann: Haha
ChuckNorris Mission: can culture or design exist without the other?
Spin Martin: well are we talking driving or modding
crucial Armitage: the giving away of land in mass is a problem
You: should we apply and prank it Uri?
Tao Takashi: probably they will mostly build crap anyway ;-)
Tao Takashi: or nobody will build anything
ChuckNorris Mission: sorry...went all zen for a minute
ravagefox Savard: wait are they buying new sims or taking
preexisting ones?
Morse Dillon is Online
You: What I'd like to know is, who sherpa'd them in ehre?
Amalthea Blanc: yay ugly cars as self expression
You: Spin?
Lordfly Digeridoo: buying new sims, ravage
You: Have a seat
Amalthea Blanc: go myspace 3D!
Spin Martin: nope
Tao Takashi: why shoudl they build stuff for GM?
Spin Martin: i have my own world to worry about
Lordfly Digeridoo: prokofy: metaverse development companies, of
course
Spin Martin: i'm not a studio like that
Lordfly Digeridoo: tao: it's free land
Simone Stern is Online
ravagefox Savard: aah
June Cela: hi prok
Khanaar Ingmann: Would this land also be available for say, third
party car makers/modders too?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I dont think the concept of Sheapaing needs to
exkist anymore
Tao Takashi: yes, but only with cars ;-)
Urizenus Sklar: is it the Sheep or the Minions?
You: They've always said that what's good for General Motors is
good for the country. How could they be wrong?
You: Frans what do you know about this?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I mean it hit Reuters and went international
Lordfly Digeridoo: well, yeah, tao, it's advertising, not being
altruistic
Tao Takashi: not my country, actually
Shaun Altman: What I want to know about this though.. is.. how
do we as inworld businesses.. compete with "free" ?
Spin Martin: they = companies = dont need sherpas anymore, they
are begging to be here
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: you don't
Rhiannon Chatnoir: sooo.. the caat is out of the bag.. nevermindaall
the press leading up to that
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's advertising
You: well that's just the old slogan, I don't think we accept it
uncritically duh
Lordfly Digeridoo: are you in the advertising business?
Shaun Altman: when these corps all come in here with their PR
gimicks and give everything away for free
Spin Martin: shaun: well my day job is a pay service in a landscape
of free
Shaun Altman: what do we do?
Frans Charming: I know nothing Prok, i hear it here first.
Gonta Maltz: there's a big problem when casual users want to buy
SL material by creators that demand RL prices.... this is simlar in
that big rl companies upset a balance of sorts
Spin Martin: you get what you pay for hehe
Shaun Altman: no but I am in the LAND business and I don't have
6 free sims to give to people
Spin Martin: sure
Shaun Altman: and maybe when these sims fill, they'll give 6 more
Spin Martin: and in fact, this competes with LL's rental efforts too
Shaun Altman: hell they're only $1250
Lordfly Digeridoo: and then GM goes bankrupt for not selling cars
ravagefox Savard: gm should pay to host their own sims :P they
have the money
Koz Farina: this is being projected on a screen in London btw ;
Lordfly Digeridoo: because they're damn near it already
ravagefox Savard: supposedly
You: This meeting is a public meeting; it is ON THE RECORD.
Shaun Altman: Spin: no not really, because LL rents the land to
GM :D
Lordfly Digeridoo: ravage: they are... they're paying LL money to
host
You: IF YOU DO NOT LIKE APPEARING IN
TRANSCRIPTS DON'T TALK
Shaun Altman: who then gives it FREE to the good citizens of SL
:D
crucial Armitage: yea gm can afford to buy the whol grid and give it
away if they felt it was worth while
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but in a marketing budet on a large corporate
scael.. 1250$ is nothing
Spin Martin: ha point shaun
Gonta Maltz: that'
Rhiannon Chatnoir: scale
Lordfly Digeridoo: so six free sims
Gonta Maltz: that's the thing, balance between virtual and rl
markets
Lordfly Digeridoo: that's like, what, giving land to, 100 people?
Lordfly Digeridoo: that HAVE to do something car related?
Spin Martin: is that griefer heaven?
Lordfly Digeridoo: is this the end of the world?
You: Here is the link I saw first on it in SL Homepage:
http://forums.slhomepage.com/showthread.php?t=265
Shaun Altman: Lordfly: its the BEGINNING
Lordfly Digeridoo: should we be writing our congressmen?
June Cela: what exactly is GM trying to accomplish?
Lordfly Digeridoo: beginning of what!
Shaun Altman: you're missing the bigger picture
You: I'm looknig for the company press release still
You: well they are selling their brand
June Cela: a better design?
Lordfly Digeridoo: dude, i'm in the bigger picture. :)
Rhiannon Chatnoir: honestly.. the corporation i work for spends
10s of thousansds on skybox seats to woo clients and brokers..
what ar a few sims
You: what else?
Koz Farina: does GM wanna blog? :)
June Cela: name recognition?
Tao Takashi: so should LL forbid GM to give land away for free?
You: Rhiannon, exactly, SL is the new skybox.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha Kox.. you go boy!
Shaun Altman: when Nike is joined by ALL the RL shoe makers,
and they make all the BEST shoes, and give them away for free
You: LIterally, they can get skyboxes here
Gonta Maltz: does GM have a myspace page?! :O
Shaun Altman: where does that leave Joe Shoemaker?
ChuckNorris Mission: GM blogs...its called Fast Lane
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: it means joe comes up with a better
design
Koz Farina: thx Chuck
Lordfly Digeridoo: obviously
Lordfly Digeridoo: welcome to capitalism
You: Well Uri explained Shaun, he is roadkill on the road to Web
2.0
Lordfly Digeridoo: consider this
Shaun Altman: when ALL the car companies join toyota/scion, and
give ALL the best cars away for free, where does that leave Joe
Carmaker?
Lordfly Digeridoo: a shoemaker like nike has no idea wtf SL is
about
ChuckNorris Mission: their bloggin has actually been pretty honest
and open.....
Urizenus Sklar: web 3.D
You: He can get a chapter in the history books and there can be a
history week on him and his artifacts 60 years from now
Lordfly Digeridoo: joe shoemaker DOES know what SL is about
Spin Martin: doesn't suprise me SL is on their radar, as they were
quick to blog and podcast
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you have a room of 2.0 peeps though Prok
Shaun Altman: it doesn't matter if they know what SL is about
Lordfly Digeridoo: ergo joe has an advantage
Shaun Altman: they have SHOES!
Tao Takashi: a shoe maker like Nike does not actually want to sell
shoes in here I guess
Shaun Altman: NIKE SHOES!
Lordfly Digeridoo: OH NJO SHOES
Shaun Altman: FREE! :D
Lordfly Digeridoo: stop the presses
Lordfly Digeridoo: shoes?!
Lordfly Digeridoo: no wai
You: well I am proudly wearing my Sonic Booms here
minxeh Volos: it leaves joe shoemaker upping there game to
compete, people will pay for the things they want in game wether
theres free stuff or not
You: I refuse to buy the Nike, Adiddas, etc
Spin Martin: intereesting how GM giving away land might compete
with rental companies, not car makers heeh
Mobile Widget: I dunno if it is gonna make me buy GM...
Mobile Widget: :)
ravagefox Savard: I wear 10$ everlasts.
You: well exactly Spin
Spin Martin: that's not the first thing i'd think to hear about
ravagefox Savard: heh
You: that's why I will be protesting : )
Shaun Altman: Spin: just wait till gm brings in chevys, GMCs,
Saabs, etc :D
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I just hope there doesn't come the day when i
am an elven shoe maker in servitude.. :P
Lordfly Digeridoo: why are you protesting? it's marketing fluff
Spin Martin: of course tho it's a niche market
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's acompany coming in to do something to
make a splash and release a press release
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yeah.. honestly.. they just want to ride the wave
of .. oo look we are in this new medium too
Lordfly Digeridoo: in the meantime 100 residents get free land
Spin Martin: parok do you do commercial rentals?
Khanaar Ingmann: Being a driver, and fan of GM Products, This is
interesting, but where does the commercialization of the SL market
leave a small time car maker like me?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: they will fade away..
Mobile Widget: will they start watching peeps that make cars
similar to their designs? and get after 'em?
June Cela: and i buy toyota
Shaun Altman: right, and damn the effects on the inworld economy
You: well I will protest merely because we are still footing the bills
here and eating most of the shit, not them
Shaun Altman: not their concern
Urizenus Sklar: yes digi, but their fluff is killing the ecology of SL
Lordfly Digeridoo: what effects?
Lordfly Digeridoo: bah, ecology
Simone Stern is Offline
Mobile Widget: digital copy and all
You: Yes ecology!
Lordfly Digeridoo: what's more fun to drive, a dominus shadow, or
a pontiac fiddlybit?
Shaun Altman: Lordfly: im not buying ur stuff if I can get equiv. stuff
free :D
You: And I don't have the LL PR machine working for MY rentals
Shaun Altman: and im sure im not alone :D
Grace McDunnough: ecology?
Koz Farina: are there restrictions on what you can do with the land
won?
You: but you can be sure Philip will be going to their press
conference, etc
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: you don't buy just a house, you buy the
design
Tao Takashi: well, just because some competition comes in here it
does not mean that the ecology is killed
Spin Martin: well ok so what, what if someone not in the rental biz
gives away space for free, as a courtesy to friends.. is it the scale
that is bothersome
Spin Martin: ?
Urizenus Sklar: yes, exactly, its about the ecology of a virtual
community
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and neither they
You: It's already dying.
Tao Takashi: the land comes for a price
Tao Takashi: and this is doing car culture
You: They have co-opted the best builders, who have turned their
sims into vacant lots or Disneyland.
ChuckNorris Mission: virtual ecologies that can die....
Shaun Altman: well im sure all the RL archetectural conglomartes
will have good designs too
You: there is no indigenous culture really, it's going fast
Rhiannon Chatnoir: honestly.. the residents and their varoius run
companies.. have done more than LL's almost inept marketing
Lordfly Digeridoo: if the fragile ecology can't put up with a
company coming in to talk about cars, then SL should go under
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: yeah, but i know what SL wants, the RL
congloms don't
You: Rhiannon that's just it, they are coming here on our backs,
invoking the user-made world
Lordfly Digeridoo: RL architects come to me asking for advice
whent hey come into SL for god's sake
Shaun Altman: SL wants pretty houses
Shaun Altman: to play house in
Shaun Altman: as cheap as possible
Cocoanut Koala: they dn't have all the best builderss
You: but it isn't user made if they pay the tier for free land
Shaun Altman: period
You: it's worst than the worst of Linden feting.
Lordfly Digeridoo: so let's say i gave away all my houses for free,
shaun
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but.. you can't stop it.. the only thing that will
cease to have them come here.. is if it is no longer 'cool'
Lordfly Digeridoo: am i ruining the ecology?
Spin Martin: any joe scmoe could do this tho
You: No, I'm not for stopping it
Tao Takashi: well, Lordfly, at some point they will know how to
use SL
Lordfly Digeridoo: if i give my houses away for free, am i runing sl?
You: I'm for organizing tho against it, and fighting it
Tao Takashi: as they know by now how to use the web
You: I'm all for a freer market
Lordfly Digeridoo: someone answer my question please
Shaun Altman: Lordfly: can you crank out an inventory of 1,000
great houses by say.. this time next month?
Spin Martin: well free it is hahaha
You: but you labour can organize in a free market, and you can still
fight for rights
ChuckNorris Mission: what are we fighting?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: then.. what exactly ar eyou for doing precisely
Prok.. and why
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: no, and neither can the top architecture
firms
ChuckNorris Mission: pushing water
Shaun Altman: and divote (in SL terms) limitless budget to
advertising?
Lordfly Digeridoo: guaranteed
Rez Menoptra is Online
You: Philip says he makes a level playing field for these companies;
he doesn't for us though
Lordfly Digeridoo: advertising = blogs
Shaun Altman: devote*
Lordfly Digeridoo: advertising = dropping houses on people
Spin Martin: what's to stop anyone,not just a big company from
giving away land
Tao Takashi: so what should be the result? Should LL ban GM
from doing that?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: it is level.. they just come in with more starter
money.. but LL didnt give them that
Tao Takashi: and with which reason?
Shaun Altman: yess all the blogs would be writing about LF's
AWESOME free houses :D
Amalthea Blanc: i dunno about you but talking about an ecology
means that there is a system in place. SL is too fluid right now in
relationships (market and otherwise) to have a defined ecology
Shaun Altman: but anyhow I think I've made my point
You: Lordfly one would think you would grasp how car loving
newbies getting free land from GM to then also design their car
loving houses will bypass YOU
Lordfly Digeridoo: if we take the argument to its absurd limits,
nobody should give anyone anything for free -- it might hurt prok's
bottom line
Shaun Altman: and that's fine if u disagree or just don't get it
Shaun Altman: I'll get off the soapbox for a bit
You: unless you are planning on winning their big build contract
You: Yes I don't believe in freebies as you know
You: I'm all for selling freebies
Urizenus Sklar: We don't need to say that this is bad, or that GM
should be stopped, but we do need to be honest about what this is
doing to the cuture of SL
Tao Takashi: well, GM can hardly give land to 400.000 people
You: Right Uri
Lordfly Digeridoo: ah, so you scam, prok?
Amalthea Blanc: Prok, what exactly IS the news?
Tao Takashi: they will stop at some point
You: that is what we CAN do, is report what IS happening
Amalthea Blanc: what is GM doing exactly
You: and not whitewash it
Tao Takashi: and beside not everybody wants to build
Lordfly Digeridoo: you're reselling IP rights without proper
permission... for shame
Tao Takashi: and I guess they need to
Gonta Maltz: What if a company came in and bought 50 sims?
crucial Armitage: any one in the land busness should be concerned
about mass land give aways
Rhiannon Chatnoir: on the bl g evidently amalthea
You: they cannot claim to use language like "empowering the
community" when they are destroying it -- and building their hype
on our backs.
Lordfly Digeridoo: gonta: what if I came in and bought 50 sims?
You: They will Gonta.
You: This is onlyt he beginning.
You: They will.
Gonta Maltz: oh yes, and what are the implications?
Lordfly Digeridoo: what if anshe bought 50 sims?
Lordfly Digeridoo: at this point" not much
Spin Martin: welcome to the bad side of user created content or
'crowdsourcing'
You: she did, but she has the users on them make their content
Lordfly
You: that's the diffrence
Tao Takashi: which reason should the have to buy 50 sims?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but see.. Prok.. if GM comes in and doesnt
take the time to get the community.. it will wwither..a nd like an old
played out print ad.. will be retired
You: it's still a micro-economy of micro-payments
Lordfly Digeridoo: prokofy: all users make content
Rhiannon Chatnoir: so the culture of the masses does win out
You: Anshe pays her workers out of rental income, not out of a
fantastic PR budget of a GM
Tao Takashi: it is still money for them and they need to tell their
boss what it's good for
You: that's the difference
Lordfly Digeridoo: GM still has to hire designers to do shit
Spin Martin: until they post on myspace hehe
Rhiannon Chatnoir: don't like it.. then boycott it
You: GMs are the camp chairs of our world
Lordfly Digeridoo: lol
Urizenus Sklar: haha
Lordfly Digeridoo: that's ridiculous
You: They have a fantastically huge camp chair called "their PR
budget"
Lordfly Digeridoo: and we have a fantastic camp chair called "free
time"
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but that is RL
Tao Takashi: but that PR budget is not for SL alone ;-)
ChuckNorris Mission: that camp chair is rapidly shrinking
Spin Martin: yeah the SL line item is pennies
You: what I find outrageous is their social rhetoric about
empowering community
Spin Martin: sell a corvette
You: that's the bullshit
Lordfly Digeridoo: that's the third thing you've found outrageous
tonight, prok
Tao Takashi: SUN has the same claim I think
Tao Takashi: but who cares about those?
ravagefox Savard: Sl could theoretically hold as many sims as
anyone wants, provided there's enough CPUs to run them.
honestly, how many sims are there in existance today? tomorrow?
what's really so wrong with GM wanting to give six away?
Shaun Altman: yes empowering the community to "interact with
brands"
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's marketing speak, what's your point?
June Cela: prok
You: it's just following the LL recipe however, where they feted
people for ages and gave them all subsidizes and free stuff to set
them up
Tao Takashi: every marketing blurb is just blurb
Lordfly Digeridoo: fic fic fic
You: them groomed the best for turning into metaversal consulting
companies
June Cela: have you posted the press release?
Amalthea Blanc: i think Prok just needs a hug :)
You: http://forums.slhomepage.com/showthread.php?t=265
Shaun Altman: Ravage: lets say the whole fortune 500 gave 6 away
You: that's the link I found to it
Lordfly Digeridoo: can't have a discussion without the FIC
Shaun Altman: whats 500 times 6?
June Cela: thanks
You: Um, no, Amalthea, I need free sims too : )
Shaun Altman: more than we presently even have :D
Lordfly Digeridoo: shaun: a ridiculous assumption
You: if they're passing out free sims
Spin Martin: i tend to think GM doesn't need any feting by anyone
Amalthea Blanc: well, one thing at a time Prok ;)
Spin Martin: that's just black helicopters
Cocoanut Koala: yay! I finally managed to achieve a seatand write
this sentence between my packet loss
You: but only the plugged-in content creators will get this free land,
right Frans?
You: right Lordfly?
Spin Martin: GM could buy SL and install it next to onstar
You: will Joe Plywood get a car culture first land? hardly
Spin Martin: let's not be totally naive
Shaun Altman: Lordfly: why? "come here, enjoy the scenery, and
interact with our brand. feel free to rez a house"
Lordfly Digeridoo: i dunno, prok, you'll get more land than i will
You: it will go to Nylon Pynckey
Lordfly Digeridoo: how many sims do you own?
Lordfly Digeridoo: how many news articles have been done about
you?
Shaun Altman: brb
You: I really do not like the idea of having to interact with brands
inside a streaming world
ravagefox Savard: i'm waiting for miscrosoft to step in :P
You: too much of a good thing if you ask me
Spin Martin: haha no comment fox
Rhiannon Chatnoir: look.. Prok.. if you wanted to content create to
contribute then do so
Lordfly Digeridoo: you interact with brands RIGHT NOW
Rhiannon Chatnoir: noone stops anyone
ChuckNorris Mission: the whole world is a brand
Lordfly Digeridoo points at spin martin and hipcast
Tao Takashi: Prok is a brand
Lordfly Digeridoo points at uri at the second life herald
Thargor Swenholt: I could go for a cold can of Coke
Lordfly Digeridoo points at prokofy neva's ravenglass rentals
ravagefox Savard: Earth(tm)
ChuckNorris Mission: this is not a world...it is a product
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you are not tied up held against your will to sell
real estate
You: Rhiannon, why would I, in a Better World, promulgate car
culture? Car culture is ruining the environment of our first world!
Lordfly Digeridoo points at shaun altman's cyberland
Lordfly Digeridoo: THESE ARE ALL BRANs
Gonta Maltz: Say companies do swoop in and spew out masses of
corperate land. Does that destroy the community? I don't think that
SL residents will flock to them, we'd be oversaturated
You: now why on EARTH would I be doing that in Better World,
Inc???
You: huh?
Spin Martin: good thing lordfly forgot about my microsoft build cuz
god knows i did heeh
Lordfly Digeridoo: guys
Lordfly Digeridoo: seriously
Lordfly Digeridoo: you're missing the absurdity of this
Spin Martin: all MTV has to do is do a special on SL
Spin Martin: post it to myspace
Lordfly Digeridoo: we're all making our own brands
Rhiannon Chatnoir: oh i know it is lorlfly
Spin Martin: LL could have nothing to do with that
Cocoanut Koala: i hatethe real life companies in SL
Amalthea Blanc: branding is part of community building
ChuckNorris Mission: How about a Real World/Road Rules
Challenge in SL?
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: why? they're just like SL companies
Amalthea Blanc: im with you Lordfly :)
Spin Martin: hey is a musician in SL a real world companie
Spin Martin: after all
Spin Martin: they sell CDs
Lordfly Digeridoo: yes, spin
Lordfly Digeridoo: jaycatt nico? totally a real company
Lordfly Digeridoo: BURN HIS PIANO
Spin Martin: most musicians are trying to do that in RL
Spin Martin: it's like
Cocoanut Koala: they are not just like SL companies
Tao Takashi: maybe don't see SL that separated from RL.. it isn't
and it will never be.. maybe just deal with it :)
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: yes they are. we all sell products
Spin Martin: we might have loved it when nike was punk rock
sellign shoes outtta a back of a van
Khanaar Ingmann: Every company in SL is a company, event
though its still in a virtual world.
You: What I hate about this game is how you just barely manage to
get ahead one week after the hell of the weeks we've had with the
game down and then wham they kick you in the teeth again
Khanaar Ingmann: we're all still making money, selling our product
Lordfly Digeridoo: how is this kicking you in the teeth, prok?
ravagefox Savard: well, you are :P
You: Lordfly, you can arrogantly spout like this because you just
figure you'll pick up the build contracts like Barnes and Co.
Lordfly Digeridoo: you're just boosting your rhetoric up again
Amalthea Blanc: oh NOES, Prok said this is a GAME!!!
Lordfly Digeridoo: prokofy: o rly
You: You have no skin in.
Amalthea Blanc: *gasp*
You: well it is Amalthea duh
Cocoanut Koala: well, GM coming in is hardly the same thing as
indiginous car builders
You: It's a thing you PLAY.
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: why? THEY ARE SELLING SL CARS
Koz Farina: soon we'll have VVC - Virtual Venture Capitalists..
maybe be already do
You: You play all kinds of stuff even if it doesn't have a POINT
Tao Takashi: for Prok it is, Thea.. This whole discussion stuff is a
game
Cocoanut Koala: no
Amalthea Blanc: damn, i was misinformed ;)
Shaun Altman: back
Lordfly Digeridoo: yes
Lordfly Digeridoo: define the difference
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha.. i met a venture capitalist i game almost a
year ago Koz
Lordfly Digeridoo: aside from apparent size
You: game is what normal people call it Tao who aren't all thinky
and educational.
Amalthea Blanc: i came here for the waterfalls :)
Cocoanut Koala: they are selling brands from multi-milliondollar ,
billion -d9lar real life companies
June Cela: already have vvc
Spin Martin: you know most of these companies dont have to deal
with LL
Spin Martin: they deal with a studio
You: the studio being ESC and MOU
Lordfly Digeridoo: yeah, all these companies bypass LL completely
Koz Farina: do they have a glorious sim? ;)
You: who are the FIC
Spin Martin: hey maybe we can blame open reg for a GM guy
signing up
You: feted and prepped for this very destiny
Lordfly Digeridoo: prok: now they're the FIC?
minxeh Volos: so then treat it like a game and stop kicking up a
fuss about somthing thats bloody stupid, the fact of the matter is
your just pissed that someone is doing something that might not
benefit you
Lordfly Digeridoo: i thought it was me
ravagefox Savard: a game, an alternative virtual reality experiment,
what's the difference? :P
You: well Reuters relies on the FIC; so does CNET; so does
everybody
You: the FIC transformed into the top metaversal consultants
You: just draw the family trees duh
Lordfly Digeridoo: yes duh
Spin Martin: and what you can't start a design studio
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes some agency.. that thinks.. oh SL is hot..
lets run some campaign in there.. goes back to GM.. this wll be o
gcool.. blah blah.. 6 sims later and cool press releases. etx.
Cocoanut Koala: oh? is that true of m as well, minxeh?
Lordfly Digeridoo: people who want to make a living here do
Cocoanut Koala: *me
You: So Frans, car culture? Comments?
Lordfly Digeridoo: companies want people who are competent
You: sigh
Lordfly Digeridoo: indeed, prok.
You: That isn't always evident Lordfly.
You: that's just the point
Lordfly Digeridoo: what?
You: when there is no open bid nor open competition
Lordfly Digeridoo: companies want incompetence?
You: just friends fixing up friends
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha... how did Frans become the baromoter
Lordfly Digeridoo: oh come on
Khanaar Ingmann: I'm all for the car culture sims, but how they will,
i dont know.
Lordfly Digeridoo: that's ridiculous
You: like Aimee says the way it SHOULD be done in SL Business
Lordfly Digeridoo: if you can't build worth a shit, you don't get
contracts. the end
Spin Martin: hello that's what biz is
Shaun Altman: there doesn't have to be an open bid
You: like cory Edo says on the Sheep blog, the way it SHOULD
be done -- just work with friends, only friends, friends you can
trust
Shaun Altman: these aren't "friends", they're businesses
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's called capitalism, prok
Koz Farina: all that will materr is how it drives ;)
Shaun Altman: that's so far from the point
Spin Martin: you could turn around and leverage the shit outta your
NY times press and dominate anshe
You: not peole you find by a cattle call, gosh, you know them for
an hour, they are strangers!
Cocoanut Koala: there are CONTRACTS, but then there are also
PRODUCTS - I'm thinking of the products
You: better to get YOUR FRIENDS
You: because they must be good, eh?
Lordfly Digeridoo: not really
Koz Farina: who here wears a tshirt with a brand logo on it?
Tao Takashi: of course you need people you can trust
Lordfly Digeridoo: my gf can't build to save her life
RacerX Gullwing is Online
You: Spin, please spare me such idiocy.
ravagefox Savard: khan. are you a stranger to me?
Shaun Altman: exactly, coco
Frans Charming: Sorry i see my name mentioned, but i can't read
fast enough to respond to anything.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: the RL business world works the same... ha
Cocoanut Koala: Rhino Vehicles compared to Mercedes Benz
Spin Martin: that's not idiocy
Koz Farina: ...in RL
Spin Martin: that's why people have 'press' links on their sites
Spin Martin: so they can show off cred
You: You can't make money in the land biz, everyone knows that.
Only content can make a profit in SL.
Lordfly Digeridoo: oh really
Lordfly Digeridoo: anshe says otherwise
Lordfly Digeridoo: and so does adam
Spin Martin: wait so what is anshe doing then
Khanaar Ingmann: Rav: uhm, nope.
Lordfly Digeridoo: and so do you
crucial Armitage: heheh people wear jeans with my own brand logo
on them *~~smiles~~*
Spin Martin: and adam
You: Lordfly, what happens if Anshe has to cash out tomorrow?
Spin Martin: and you
You: Can she?
ravagefox Savard: khan: point. lets go build cars :P
Rhiannon Chatnoir: then do what Anshe did.. hire a contract dev
studio and start competing Prok
You: Is that her 4 million sitting at the 272 spot now?
Lordfly Digeridoo: prokofy: then you step in and cackle insanely,
obviously. duh.
Koz Farina: some consumers will want to be accossiated with
them. some guys love their car more than their wife
Lordfly Digeridoo: you're her competition
You: Seriously, what is land worth, when you cannot cash it out
tomorrow?
Lordfly Digeridoo: you step in and take her business
Tao Takashi: so I wonder why people do land business then
Lordfly Digeridoo: i dunno, you're in the land business, you tell me
Tao Takashi: let GM do it ;-)
Cocoanut Koala: Do I make a real car in real life? No. Does
Mercedes Benz? Yes.
You: but PSP and a resume with 20th Century fox is worth
something
You: see the point?
Lordfly Digeridoo: no i don't.
You: ther eis no value in land, really
June Cela: no its lindens 4 mill
Lordfly Digeridoo: there isn't value in anything
You: well you are being deliberately obtuse then
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's all relative
Lordfly Digeridoo: the US dollar? floating on fiat.
You: what you cannot cash out and carry is worthless
You: CASH and CARRY
Lordfly Digeridoo: CASH AND CARRY ON FIAT
CURRENCY
You: What are Anshe's millions worth?
Lordfly Digeridoo: zomg fic dollar bill US mint
You: oh bullshit
Rhiannon Chatnoir: it is just liek RL.. if you personally dont think
there is much hope in the future of your business.. you find a way to
take yoru assets and transfer it over to soemthing you think will be
successful
You: you can leave your vendors to keep kachining and go play
WOW
ravagefox Savard: prok: is life only about money?
You: I have to grunt here toiling in the soil like a peasant to make a
dime
Spin Martin: mortgagesa re about money
Lordfly Digeridoo: ROFL
You: No it's about tier favage
Amalthea Blanc: the beatles said "all you need is love"!
Shaun Altman: well im not really up for a cut-throat argument :D
Spin Martin: i tried to pay my mortgage with a hug and a smile,
didn't go so well
Lordfly Digeridoo: prok, i can guaran-fuckin-tee i work harder in
SL than you do
Cocoanut Koala: Thus,the SL Car makers may very well not
cotton to competing with people who actually make real cars, and
have been for ages, with the brand well-iknown
ravagefox Savard: o_O
Shaun Altman: im going to run for a while.. would love a transcript
tho
Shaun Altman: see u all later
Spin Martin: well car culture is relgious
You: I'd like yoou all to think beyond LF's little sectarian arguments
here tho
You: what good will GM do?
Spin Martin: i wouldn't be caught dead driving a ford in here
Lordfly Digeridoo: yes, ignore me, listne to prok!
Lordfly Digeridoo: she has all the good ideas
You: 6 sims of newbies with free land will bring you customers?
Tao Takashi: what bad will it do?
Khamon Fate is Online
Lordfly Digeridoo: prok: will it bring you customers?
Cocoanut Koala: same for shoes
You: so you will get a windfall from it, right Rhianna? maybe
rethink it?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: hey.. I pay tier and don't even sell things in
world or bitch that I am being held back for some reason cause of
it
Spin Martin: of course
You: No
Spin Martin: yeah no shoe maker can do what shiny shiny does
Spin Martin: er shiny things
You: unless they get sick of car culture but want to stay in SL
Lordfly Digeridoo: and then you sell land to them, prok
Lordfly Digeridoo: the HORROR
You: Who brought them in here Spin do you know that?
ravagefox Savard: what about shiny shoes?
You: I don't sell land Lordfly; I rent it
Lordfly Digeridoo: yahoo.com, prok
Lordfly Digeridoo: cnn.com, prok
Cocoanut Koala: Lordfly, you and I don't have to worry much
about this
Lordfly Digeridoo: your NY Times article, prok
Spin Martin: i didn't know they were officially here
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: i'm not worrying at all. i'm profiting from
all of this
Cocoanut Koala: because there are few well-known housemakr
gbrands
ravagefox Savard: hell, BBC1 is in sl
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yeah.. yahoo, reuters, wired, business week..
the lsit goes on
Koz Farina: lol@lord
You: ? it's not "my" article -- and that's yesterday's newspaper --
not even linked today
Spin Martin: god those companies are so feted
Frans Charming: Prok, will the GM media machina not bring in
more people then those 6 sims can handle, woun't those extra
people just end up in Ravenglass rentals.
Cocoanut Koala: and what there are, are not likely to come
compete with us for houses.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I ran into peopel that were getting the
syndicated content in Palesting and turkish local news outlets
You: No, Frans it doesn't work like that
Koz Farina: BBC is a ghosttown
Khanaar Ingmann: the canadian phone carrier... Tulus is in here.
Tao Takashi: the success of SL brought them in here basically
You: when the Lindens put out Shermville or whatsis, it decided
depressed the market
Lordfly Digeridoo: shermville?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: this my friends is the scaling up.. can't hold
back the rolling ball
Lordfly Digeridoo: wtf is shermville?
Khanaar Ingmann: Telus
Koz Farina: Tire Kickers
Spin Martin: if poeple didn't want RL brands, why do people make
red bull and coke machines
Koz Farina: Chavatars
Cocoanut Koala: Martha Stewart has a line of houses
You: You have to look at the REAL numbers
Spin Martin: why are there fake ipods and macs if people hated RL
brands
ravagefox Savard: why do i have a can of Frozen Run :P
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: and/ i can make better SL houses than
her designers can.
You: Dreamland has 800 customers in one group; I have 400 in
Ravenglass but about 1000 total
You: the numbers aren't great
Lordfly Digeridoo: or, if she wants to HIRE me for that work,
that's fine too.
Doctoe Schnook: exactly - what will thede ompanies continue to
offer that is of value?
You: if GM brings in 16 x 6, that's a huge dent
You: in the actual market
Lordfly Digeridoo: no it isn't
You: most people fly around and don't light, they don't rent
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's 6 sims out of 3000+
Tao Takashi: if they don't like RL brand why are they gathering up
somewhere just because somebody whispered "nike"? :)
Lordfly Digeridoo: math 6 / 3000
Lordfly Digeridoo: oh, fucking no scripts
You: Only something like 20 p ercent of the people buy land or
rent, the rest fly around
Cocoanut Koala: well, maybe so, but you and I don't have the
NAME BRAND recognition, or the REAL WORLD houses!
Spin Martin: haha the si is called motorati
Spin Martin: haha
Spin Martin: tekkie motorati!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you can't mean to tell me that you think 50,000
new users in one day won't even maybe bring in a small precentage
of poeple who will stay around in SL and want to maybe rent land
at some point
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: so? a paycheck is a paycheck
Cocoanut Koala: but cars, shoes, etc. - those do cut in on SL
producers
Lordfly Digeridoo: if martha stewart comes in and says "build me
some houses", i'd design them houses for my going rate.
Spin Martin: how coco?
You: GM is supplying events grants and First Land.
Spin Martin: while beautiful, the adidas and reebok shoes
Spin Martin: suck ass
You: they are making sticky sims that will keep avatars, frame their
experience
Spin Martin: too primmy
You: it's what's SL has needed
You: people who care and stay with newbies, unlike Lindens who
don't
Cocoanut Koala: so as you can see
You: so then those newbies will go on to spend $1500 per 4 hour
log-in
You: it's a content maker's dream, GM's islands
Lordfly Digeridoo: wait, prok
Cocoanut Koala: lordfly, I'm not saying "she will hire lordfly"
Lordfly Digeridoo: so now you're FOR GM coming into SL?
You: all it does is ruin the land model for SL tho
You: the land model is finished as a busines model
Cocoanut Koala: I'm saying, what happens to Lordfly if she doesn't
hire him?
Spin Martin: are there any content makers who are also land
barons
You: why on EARTH would I buy another friggin' sim from Philip
Lidnen
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: then i work for her competition
You: when GM will buy them?
Lordfly Digeridoo: and make the same amount of money
You: the mainland will be finished
Cocoanut Koala: ok lordfly
Cocoanut Koala: but what about those who don't want to work for
someone else?
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's called freelancing, and it's delicious
Spin Martin: actually interestingly, we'd have dozens of mainlands
Tao Takashi: Prokofy: You would buy because there is demand
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: then you have to rely on your superior
designs
Tao Takashi: GM will not buy sims for everybody
Rhiannon Chatnoir: Anshe now has a content creation studio..
based otu fo china.. i am sure mostly for her own sim prodctuion
needs
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but.. you evolve or die in business
Cocoanut Koala: by your scenario- and LL's, eventually, by the
way - there will be no more indigenous producers
Rhiannon Chatnoir: as harsh as that is
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: maybe so, but i don't think martha stewart
will ever care about virtual housing
Spin Martin: heh
Lordfly Digeridoo: and nor will any other company
You: well except that we were the ones that helped them through
their bug-testing for 4 years
Lordfly Digeridoo: ergo, it's a market that canbe filled by smaller
companies -- namely, you.
ravagefox Savard: marthat's too busy playing 'stock amrket'
You: perhaps we should get compensation then when they close
the mainland
ravagefox Savard: *market
Cocoanut Koala: supererior design cannot compete with people
who make the same thing in the real wold
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: yes it can
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. we probably were/are paying for a beta in
a sense
Lordfly Digeridoo: SL has proven that
Spin Martin: how pessimistic
Frans Charming: They never promised future riches for those years
of bug testing .
Cocoanut Koala: no, lordfly, it can't
Amalthea Blanc: i want those bugs that i found back in the client!!
Amalthea Blanc: not playing this game anymore
Amalthea Blanc: :P
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: oh really? neph and neil must be an
illusion, then.
Spin Martin: i think SL brands can easily survive against these
people
Cocoanut Koala: the real world has an advantage
Spin Martin: what, money?
Lordfly Digeridoo: and myself? i guess i haven't paid for college at
all
Spin Martin: RL stipends
ravagefox Savard: why because its not digital?
Cocoanut Koala: Lordfly, you are arguing from the wrong end
Amalthea Blanc: just one, Cocoanut? :D
Spin Martin: her'es a 1/4 mill
Cocoanut Koala: I am trying to get yo to see that real world large
businesses
Cocoanut Koala: such as Mercedez Benz
Lordfly Digeridoo: cannot move fast enough
Cocoanut Koala: have products in the real world already built up
Lordfly Digeridoo: they CANNOT react as quickly as I can to
market demands
Lordfly Digeridoo: big companies move slowly and decisively.
small companies react quicker and adapt faster
Cocoanut Koala: they are qualitatively different from totally virtual
products
Lordfly Digeridoo: SL content producers = small companies
Spin Martin: i seriously doubt GM could build a truck like Khanaar
over there
You: well let's also wonder about this: will they find 16 x 6 car
lovers? I mean, if you are a car lover, do you want to come in and
dick around with a virtual car you can't even drive because the sim
crossings suck?
ravagefox Savard: khan! you're a company!
Cocoanut Koala: well, olordfly, I have no intention of rolling over
and dying, either - but that's not the point
Rhiannon Chatnoir: th ekey is they will not intimately know the
mmunity and will have their own larger corporate marketing goals..
so in mos tcases .. no.. they will not last the test of time
Spin Martin: and i'm deeply in love with car culture
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: then you'll do fine
Lordfly Digeridoo: if you give up, you lost
Khanaar Ingmann: Yes.. yes i am
Lordfly Digeridoo: big companies cannot take over 100% of the
market
Lordfly Digeridoo: AND
Rhiannon Chatnoir: unless they choose to also put in the investment
of really learning this world.. and then if they do.. that is a good
thing anyway
Cocoanut Koala: i think also I will do fine, because the real world
companies will each be something like a flash in the pan
Lordfly Digeridoo: if you are confident of your own abilities, you'll
make it just fine
Spin Martin: i dunno i am thinking about terrforming mainland to
accomodate jeeps and such
Cocoanut Koala: Exactly, rhiannon
Mobile Widget: (SIM crossings) wonder if LL could work on that
a bit with GM coming. :)
Spin Martin: because driving is fun in SL if you bother to get off
your ass and allow new things in
Cocoanut Koala: lordfly, I am not worried about my "making it"
You: Rhiannon, I wonder, is it really something that is so special,
"really learning this world"?
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: then what are you worried about?
You: Spin, um, have you ever driven?
Cocoanut Koala: I'm talking about the impact of real-world
companies on indiginous usinesses
Spin Martin: i'm open to figuring out how to learn to drie in SL
You: Spin we've been there and done it
Spin Martin: yes all the time and sim crossings suck, so i adapt
You: it sucks really
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: there is none. you just admitted tha tyou'll
be doing fine
You: even on islands where you have the best cars
Spin Martin: and as a result
Spin Martin: i have fun
Lordfly Digeridoo: ergo, small businesses will adapt and thrive
Spin Martin: i win and so does an SL content creator, not a big guy
You: well only with the Social Darwinism code will they "adapt"
Tao Takashi: Well, I guess I go to bed :)
Rhiannon Chatnoir: absolutely.. to them it is knowing their market..
and if they arent getting anything out of this
'market/world/whatever' they will not spend advertising money
Spin Martin: fine then so be it, adapt and get paid
Tao Takashi: so good night
Cocoanut Koala: no, lordfly, I don't see how you can confidently
state "there is no effect" - that's kind of crazed, in fact
Lordfly Digeridoo: social darwinism code? busting out some racist
comments there, prok?
Spin Martin: god you people make me awant to get into rentals and
do car culture so i can prove that i can charge money for car
culture land and beat gm
Spin Martin: i'm just lazy
You: rolls eyes
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha Spin
Spin Martin: rolling eyes is why you get rolled over
Spin Martin: seriously
Amalthea Blanc: hrm car culture is NOT all about driving
You: what is racism about social darwinism? social darwinism is
social darwinism
Cocoanut Koala: I am glad to see, and have fair hopes for,Reuters
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: the only effect is increased competition
ravagefox Savard: khan. i have a job for you. beat GM
Spin Martin: yeah amalthea had a kille rpoint
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you can be the first used car blogger
Lordfly Digeridoo: if you have good designs, competition isn't a
concern
Spin Martin: car culture also is about modsa nd style
Khamon Fate: i love cats, does that count?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: in SL
Lordfly Digeridoo: hi khamon
You: saying that businesses have to adapt or die, when what you
mean is that they must prop up the Lindens sagging business model
and laggy sims while they bring in the big customers
Cocoanut Koala: well lordfly, it's like . . . the competition is a
qualitativelydifferent thing altogether
You: that's not adaptation -- that's exploitation.
Khanaar Ingmann: If GM Dies... I've beaten it.
Khamon Fate: hello LF
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: how so?
Spin Martin: heh heya kamon
Lordfly Digeridoo: Big House Company comes in and sells houses
ravagefox Savard: bahaha
Lordfly Digeridoo: Digeridoo DEsigns sells houses
You: Hi Khamon
Lordfly Digeridoo: best company wins.
Khamon Fate: hi spin & marty
Spin Martin: heh
Rhiannon Chatnoir: just like the RL world
Khamon Fate: hallo prok
Cocoanut Koala: I've already said how so - they havereal world
products, and a real-world name,
Cocoanut Koala: which Neph does not, unless she starts sewing
You: not really Rhiannon because in RL, there is no Linden Lab to
help and fete them, there's more of a fair playing field.
Lordfly Digeridoo: you guys are trying to hold back the tide of
capitalism in SL like SL is some sort of grand social experiment
where we can all live free and make love on the commons
Rhiannon Chatnoir: the only advantes we have here.. is having h e
up on knowing the community more
You: No, not me
You: I'm all for the tide of capitalism
Lordfly Digeridoo: prok: then why are you hating GM?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. but IRL.. your contacts are limited via
your geography
You: but labour has to organize too
Cocoanut Koala: i dont think anyone is trying to hold anything back
Rhiannon Chatnoir: much easier to get your stuff noticed here than
it ever is IRL
You: because they are flooding the economy with socialism
Lordfly Digeridoo: prokofy: they did when you weren't doing any
of it... we're now being paid handsomely
You: socialism in the form of freebies
Cocoanut Koala: i said I don't like it that the big dogs are coming in
You: they are devaluing my capitalist values of land
Khanaar Ingmann: GM has been in a big downward spiral lately.
From having the most bulletproof trucks and engines to modern
low reliability plastic cars and daiwoo rebadges.
Spin Martin: so what's the solution to stopping a customer from
coming in and doing something for free that competes with you
You: if they have a product, let them sell it normally
Spin Martin: what's the solution you proopse
You: without loss leaders paid by camp chairs
Spin Martin: propose*
Cocoanut Koala: and I agree with prok on that
Lordfly Digeridoo: prok, what prevents me from undercutting your
business?
You: camp chairs in the form of their marketing budgets
Lordfly Digeridoo: seriously
Cocoanut Koala: they can afford to give away things, all real life
companies can, which is another difference
Lordfly Digeridoo: if i came in and just overtook ravenglass rentals
by undercutting you, what then?
You: it is like the way Boliver Oddfellow bragged that he didn't
need Lindens, didn't need tips for his bars in Dublin, he has his PR
firm's budget
Khamon Fate: but this world doesn't require that a "business" make
money to survive
You: Im' against the socialism of Big Companies in our capitalist
world, yes indeedy.
Lordfly Digeridoo: socialism of big capitalism
Khamon Fate: it's more like working for the state and only needing
to spend money out of the magically provided budget
Cocoanut Koala: we are in our own little Linden economy, by and
large
Lordfly Digeridoo: that's retarded.
Spin Martin: yeah and big companies have more money than god
by being socialist capitalist
Spin Martin: ironic no
Cocoanut Koala: they are like rich countries of their own, their LL
presence is a drop in the bucket to them
Lordfly Digeridoo: and?
Lordfly Digeridoo: we're a tiny country
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. but innately we are not all created equal in
how we come to the table here.. we all have different skills and we
all hae different purse strings and connections.. soo
Khamon Fate: there's nothing to stop someone with real world
deep pockets from gaming the customer base in any field
Lordfly Digeridoo: coke's advertising budget for Samoa is a drop
in their bucket too
You: yes Rhiannon but some have been more feted than others
Spin Martin: do all residents have the same income level
Spin Martin: ?
Cocoanut Koala: yes,exactlylordfly
Rhiannon Chatnoir: can't smash Bolliver or anyone else for what
they bring in inately into this space
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: i don't see your point
Khamon Fate: right LF
Lordfly Digeridoo: you just keep saying "well, i don't like it"
Lordfly Digeridoo: and that's fine
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but feted means nothing to GM.. is is nothing
Lordfly Digeridoo: but it's happening anyways
You: well then they shouldn't have had this model Rhiannon
Cocoanut Koala: like - they might tae some of our goods and put
them in a quaint museum someday
Spin Martin: does everyone in SL have the same income, just
wanna be clear on level playing field
Lordfly Digeridoo: so get used to it and adapt, or refuse to adapt
and fail.
Spin Martin: i mean RL income to fund our addiction
Cocoanut Koala: lordfly, what do you think I am doing?
You: the model is: let's make saps buy mainland sims and prop up
LL's cash flow while they fete their content creators
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and someday it will be just a small blip of past
history
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: then why are you worried? why are you
hating it? you're doing fine. stop worrying about it.
You: those creators then go to work for big companies who then
give land away free and ruinthe land busienss
Cocoanut Koala: I really don't want SL to become Advertising
World
ravagefox Savard: income, what's that?
You: I'm just not for them being deceptive about what they are
doing
Spin Martin: and new creators are born
You: which is devaluing land
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: it already is
Spin Martin: and more new ones
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: fly around the mainland
You: which is their socialist belief at heart all along
You: at least come clean about it
Cocoanut Koala: yes, but it was OUR advertising!
Khanaar Ingmann: I've been living on the incoms of SL themselved
for the last few months.
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: you'll see billboards and shops
EVERYWHERE
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: WHATS THE DIFFERENCE
Lordfly Digeridoo: I am a hostile company. Coke is a hostile
company.
Spin Martin: yeah prim cubes never existed before General Motors
ravagefox Savard: advertissing world? sl ALREADY is advertising
world
Cocoanut Koala: lordfly, what is the difference between an ant and
a rhinocerous?
Spin Martin: i bought sarah nerds land just cuz i was tired of
looking at those god awful cubes
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yeah.. I shelll out $125 a month for tier.. no
income in SL making up for that.. so is that an even playing field
compared to most newbies
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: ants have been aroudn for 160 million
years
You: Well there's also this, Khamon, you know that Philip keeps
claiming that there is no economy of scale
Rhiannon Chatnoir: does that make me evil
Khanaar Ingmann: The new Chevrolet Prim Cube GT.
Spin Martin: hhaahah
You: but of course having 6 free sims with car lovers getting free
land IS an economy of scale in our terms
Lordfly Digeridoo: ants have been aroudn because they
ADAPTED
Spin Martin: big orange cubes spinning on 16 sq m land
Cocoanut Koala: lol lordfly, that's kind of what I'm hoping will
happen yhere
Spin Martin: WE REZ EXCITEMENT!
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: it will. economic dynamics demand it
Spin Martin: haha
ravagefox Savard: heh
Lordfly Digeridoo: so stop worrying
Spin Martin: Mr. Lee's greater hongkong will be pisssed
Cocoanut Koala: demand what? the death of the big companies?
Lordfly Digeridoo: 6 sims out of 3000 is already irrelevent minus
the press release
Khamon Fate: prok the land is only ever going to be worth what
people are willing to pay for it. it has no inherent value, natural
resources, proximity to commercial avenues etc
Spin Martin: big comanies dont even have a clue how to be
annoying in here
Spin Martin: ever conssoder that?
Spin Martin: casinos are more obnoxious
Spin Martin: worry when Bally's shows up ahah
Spin Martin: 400 sims
Lordfly Digeridoo: as this conversation spins around and around,
i'm going to get back to work working for -- gasp -- RL
companies coming in here
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yeah
You: IT will cost them some $25,000 only to run those 6 sims for a
year -- for them that's nothing
Cocoanut Koala: well la de da , lordfly!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: rock on lordfly ;)
Cocoanut Koala: I'm going to get back to working on my OWN
work!
You: when I think of the sweat and blood of someone like
Desmond Shang accomplishing what he has with 6 sims
Khamon Fate: byeo LF
You: it's sad really
You: very sad
Spin Martin: i wanna hear what happens is Hustler or PLayboy
shows up
Lordfly Digeridoo: coco: me too! it's mine, under my IP
Spin Martin: will the scene in that space love or hate it
Khamon Fate: is the free land for just one year? then the people
have to move along?
Lordfly Digeridoo: digeridoo designs has the work
Cocoanut Koala: great, lordfly
Lordfly Digeridoo: companies are just paying me for it
Cocoanut Koala: i understand
Lordfly Digeridoo: it's awesome
Lordfly Digeridoo: i get to doodle and get paid
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but.. Desmond will keep having succes.. he
created a community.. and that is a tougher thing to do
You: Lordfly, it's 6 sims times 6000
Cocoanut Koala: cool!
You: beacuse there will be Ford, GM, Toyota
Lordfly Digeridoo: anyhow, i guess that makes me the worst
person evar. ciao
You: all of them
You: all doing this
You: all of them
minxeh Volos: see ya Lordfly
ravagefox Savard: so you bring SL up to RL par
You: Sony is going to rent apartments too I read
ravagefox Savard: heh
You: but SL was supposed to be more than RL
Cocoanut Koala: you know
You: Better World?
ravagefox Savard: how much will they charge?
You: the best we can do is car culture?
You: ?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: if you want .. you can improve what you offer
to renterts to compete if you feel you need the extra edge
Cocoanut Koala: it is so much like that, if you are smart, you will
go work for the big real-life companies
Amalthea Blanc: yeah? i thought SL was just supposed to be a
game ;)
Spin Martin: evernotice that real estate in RL goes through this too
Khamon Fate: ha ha ha better world, nobody ever fell for that
however many times philip said it
Spin Martin: big dev comes in
You: It is a game Amalthea
You: it's a game about making a Better World
Spin Martin: imminnet domain
You: you play it
Spin Martin: you have it easy
You: it's a game
ravagefox Savard: its a game about economy
Amalthea Blanc: how can a game be a better world
Amalthea Blanc: :P
Subghoul Epsilon: look at the reaction to sony/bmg so far
Cocoanut Koala: it's a game about making cotages!
Frans Charming: if Sl is supposed to be more then RL, then
shouldn't RL also be a part of it.
Spin Martin: i lrbrlrf up lsdt month@
Spin Martin: er
You: I'm not going to call it a "business application" when what I
buy in it is devalued within seconds by preferred OTHEr customers
who then give it away for free?
Spin Martin: I leveled up last month
You: Shaun would you ever buy anothoer island from these
people?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha Spin
You: oh he left
Cocoanut Koala: exactly, prok
Khamon Fate: yeah frans, if this is a better world, real world will
migrate into it at every possible junction
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I only tiered up.. lucky bastard ;)
Cocoanut Koala: that's what i mean by real0life businesses are
qualitiatively different
You: RL has to be aprt of it
Cocoanut Koala: what we REALLY do, they play at
You: the question is, on whose terms? Benefitting whom?
Amalthea Blanc: it seems that what you're protesting is these
people who are not acting with the same restrictions of the game
that you have
You: Who profits?
Doctoe Schnook: life is a game - SL is just a reflection and
extension of the aspects of play we emply in meat space
You: Amalthea, I have bought land at a high price, and now it is
devalued, that's all.
Doctoe Schnook: employ
Amalthea Blanc: but the thing is...SL doesnt really have established
rules, they modify with every player that comes into the world
ravagefox Savard: heh. 'meat space' is it called?
You: That's what anyone can take home from it -- devaluation -- of
land and labour.
You: IN a flash, in a heartbeat.
Spin Martin: you know, 'our world' refers to anyone who creates
an acct
Khanaar Ingmann: Meatbags in meatspace.
Spin Martin: unless we are gonna have different drinking fountains
Doctoe Schnook: early adopters always suffer from buying at a
high price
You: Of course I don't plan to close my business, I will soldier on
as I have soldiered on for 2 years of everything they've thrown at
us
Amalthea Blanc: yes , Doctoe
Khamon Fate: not for me. my product is entirely virtual and always
will be. the money i make here stays here by buying more land,
paying more tier, uploading more textures.
You: but it's important to report accurately what is happening
minxeh Volos: but surely you knew the risks when you bought the
land in the first place, you knew it ould devalue but you bought it
anyway?
You: the big dam is flooding the little villages; what comes in their
place is not better necessarily.
ravagefox Savard: khamon has fun
You: yes I hardly need any little lectures about risks, truly
Spin Martin: heh the irony is that gm coming in here, will have a
chorus of people who will say 'so what their cars suck lawl' and
move on and wait for a good car company to come in
You: I'm on the mainland, not off on the more lucrative islands
Spin Martin: that's the side we dont wanna admit
Khamon Fate: yes khamon is a hobbyist and has no intention of
letting this become a second job or sudden career move
Subghoul Epsilon: are you losing money prokofy?
You: What's to admit Spin?
ravagefox Savard: Walmart VS local general store?
You: GM is damn smart
Doctoe Schnook: what is happening here is just like the big
supermarket coming to the local shopping streets
Cocoanut Koala: nobody's cars will work well though!
You: their car being crappy is hardly the point
Spin Martin: that people like brands
You: they figured out what to do NEXT
minxeh Volos: your the one spouting on about its devaluation, yet
you knew it could happen so why be angry now it was always a
possibility
Cocoanut Koala: cars just dont work well in SL
Spin Martin: god if mercedes came in
Spin Martin: i'd be all over that
You: which is to move away from crappy cars and make car
culture for people online
Spin Martin: audi? not so much
You: they figured it out rEAL FAST
You: better than Nissan, which just gave away free cras
Khamon Fate: estates aren't inherently lucrative. i doubt fate
gardens would make any more income for being on an island
You: giving away free land is the heart of SL
Gonta Maltz: too bad no one drive cars isl D:
You: everyone needs free land
You: I need free land
Cocoanut Koala: I think of it more like a high school, and all of a
sudden real movie companies come in, real
You: who doesn't want free server space?
Cocoanut Koala: spr9fessional sports teams come in, etc.
Khamon Fate: for that matter, it hasn't made any less money for the
grid being down so much the past three months
ravagefox Savard: heh
Doctoe Schnook: i am not bothered about established brands - i
am bothered about who can offer me more - more personlaised
service etc
Khanaar Ingmann: Cars will never work well enough on SL. The
more code to make them more realisitc, the more lag they
generate.
You: Car culture isn't about driving as we all know.
Spin Martin: yeah gmail has free storage dont they
Spin Martin: host SL land there
Cocoanut Koala: only its worse, cause our products don't EXIST
in reality
You: It's about waxing and washing on Saturday morning and
talking about car parts.
Amalthea Blanc: lol
Cocoanut Koala: i feel bad for the car people, but hope, like
Lordfly suggests, that the beasts will die off
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but to some people it is
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you might not be a car person.. but there are a
lot that are
Spin Martin: interesting as the owner of a gm product,i dont care
about free land, yet i pay for 4.5 sims, i just wanna tweak a virtual
version of my truck
Khamon Fate: on the other hand coco, texture exist in the real
world. i imagine most designers could quickly learn to build in any
new virtual world platform and port their textures to fit
Spin Martin: so that's a data point for folks like khan
You: Spin, you pay for your 4.5 sims from clients' fees though, not
rent.
Cocoanut Koala: I would like to work for a real -life company -
but just one, a scrpapbook store!
Spin Martin: yeah you know i kinda dont have clients, that's sorta a
myth
You: You do not till the land by the sweat of your brow like we
labouring peasants here on the mainland.
You: : )
Cocoanut Koala: I would love to make a virtual scrapbook store
for them
Khamon Fate: any of us could likely migrate out business from this
world to another
Khanaar Ingmann: Spin: Contact me about your Colorado
Frans Charming: Prok, i guess the only way you can fight back, is
taking you business there. Offer them a Ravenglass Motel.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: he made that money fromt eh sweat of his RL
brow in getting those clients.. novel idea eh
Amalthea Blanc: gnite all, i have to go get some shut-eye :)
Cocoanut Koala: I've even thought aboutgoing out and grabbing
one and convincing them to get in ere
Amalthea Blanc: this has been very enlighting
crucial Armitage: /aoon
Mobile Widget: heh
Spin Martin: you got it :)
Cocoanut Koala: i think everyone who goes to college should take
logic
You: yes Coco
Frans Charming: Get people to for housing, while you get land free
Gonta Maltz: :D
Frans Charming: *pay
John Kew: lol.. +1 to logic.
Cocoanut Koala: these conversations ould then be more orerly
You: I'm sure Barnes and Ingrids will love the GM thing, they will
sell prefabs
Cocoanut Koala: *orderly
You: of course LF is loving it for that reason
You: prefabs to go with the shiny cars
Khamon Fate: i had to take symbolic logic. that was fun
Khanaar Ingmann: I agree... Order is needed.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. you hae to learn to become a good
marketer of your own things.. same way as if you had a RL small
business
Khanaar Ingmann: I'm really lost.
You: rhetoric is alos a good course to take
Cocoanut Koala: yes, well, i guess if you are in with whoever is
doing the GM thing, you get your stuff in there
Spin Martin: hehe
crucial Armitage: have a great night all this has been an inteisting
discussion but i must be going busness to attend to
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and shiny cars and new hosues look good on
your rented house plots Prok
Khamon Fate: do you really want to work coco? work for a real
company?
Cocoanut Koala: just a scrapbook one
You: Uri are you AFK?
You: what do you think?
Khamon Fate: i want to work for linden lab so i can just sit
ar^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h^h be nice khamon
Cocoanut Koala: that's all that tempts me
You: be nice Khamon!
You: don't be mean!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha Khamon
You: don't bite the hand that feeds you!
Khamon Fate: doesn't feed me
You: what if GM builds it and they don't come?
Khamon Fate: feeds itself
Cocoanut Koala: you mean, don't bite the hand wefeed!
You: it will be griefed by alts?
You: yes Coco that is the root of my beef
Rhiannon Chatnoir: then they pull out since it isnt effective
advertising dollars spent
You: WE FEED THEM
Cocoanut Koala: our time is limited, really
You: we have BEEN feeding them
Simeon Maradona is Offline
Cocoanut Koala: if things go as they wish, it will all be Advertising
World
You: oh but Philip disgarees
You: you saw him in the Times
ravagefox Savard: it already IS advertising world
Cocoanut Koala: people coming in and playing for a bit with
products they can buy in the real world
You: he says, but if you don't want to see GM stuff, don't go to
their island
ravagefox Savard: everywhere I go, I see RL and SL advertising
You: pick another island
Khamon Fate: i don't. fate gardens pays its own tier. i haven't
invested any personal money in SL
You: change the channel, surf to the next page
You: no worries
Khanaar Ingmann: Welcome, Fox.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: but they feed you too.. or else.. why would you
be here.. I honestly hope you wouldnt pay to be tortured and live
with it.. that would be horrible saddening
Fox Diller: Sup Prok!
Fox Diller: Heya Khan.
You: Hi
ravagefox Savard: hell, Khan advertises in my face ever night :P
Khamon Fate: that reminds me i gotta fix up fategardens.net before
the next update
Rhiannon Chatnoir: even if it isnt money.. we all get something from
this space
Khamon Fate: hio fox
Khanaar Ingmann: Rav, buy more cars.
Spin Martin: heya fox
Cocoanut Koala: they feed me by giving me a way to make things
Fox Diller: Heya Spin. :)
You: Yes Rhiannon I guess that sums it up
ravagefox Savard: hey fox
Khamon Fate: yeah it's fun and i've learned loads about 3d
graphics and such
You: there are easier ways to make money than tilling the mainland,
believe me
Fox Diller: Rav. :D
Khanaar Ingmann: KCC Motors wants your money. Buy KCC
Cars.
You: Khanaar will you be GOM'd?
Spin Martin: i buy kcc cars and then some :)
You: or GM'd?
ravagefox Savard: khan hipnotizes me with his ..logo
Rhiannon Chatnoir: exactly.. wether it be a =n outlet to express
visual ideas or make social connections or create a burgeoning
business
Khamon Fate: there are easier ways to make real money than
doing anything in SL
Khanaar Ingmann: Prok, What?
You: are you to be co-opted? by GM?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: e all get something.. or we would lose interes
iand leave
Spin Martin: funny this conversation goes on with apple all the time.
they are the little guy and they been gomming shit for years
You: as a someone who makes cars?
Khamon Fate: everything here is protracted and costly and time
consuming for way more than it's worth in real income
ravagefox Savard: wait, i dont even know fox o_O :P
Spin Martin: software developers who make a little widget and
then wham
Khanaar Ingmann: Nah. I'm an independant auto maker.
You: yes Khamon
Khamon Fate: but it's a better world right?
You: but not for GM
Khamon Fate: somehow
You: GM has camp chairs -- they have fairy godmothers -- they
have the PR budget
Khanaar Ingmann: I work on my own, for myself right now.
You: but that is my point Khanaar
You: if GM comes in to sell cars with their huge budget
Spin Martin: i just can't beleive you take a defeatist attitude
You: will anyone buy yours?
Khamon Fate: true prok, but it's their real life business to advertise
and make money
ravagefox Savard: i would
Rhiannon Chatnoir: noone ever promised you this would be a
closed community
Fox Diller: I would.
You: Il don't Spin, I have been here 2 years eating the most
phenomenal crap -- you have NO idea
Subghoul Epsilon: will GM have the skills to buld great cars?
Khamon Fate: this is not my, or your, real life business
Khamon Fate: there's a vast difference between why we're here
and why they're here
Khanaar Ingmann: Will GM put their efforts into their cars?
Cocoanut Koala: GM hires people, they make the cars they are
told to, with their SL skills they already had
ravagefox Savard: i want to see a GM SL car
You: I just find it hugely ironic that each time you manage to dart
ahead after the incredible difficulties some new horror is put over
on your
Fox Diller: What does Second Life mean to GM, Prok?
You: like clockwork
ravagefox Savard: i'll compare it to KCC or Fox Motors cars
You: It means a marketing gambit?
Subghoul Epsilon: well then, that's great for skilled SL residents
Cocoanut Koala: why do you think everyone is crawling all over
themselves to do the work for them?
Fox Diller: Does it?
You: 6 free sims of land is like giving a few free cars away to
clients in the media buying biz?
You: or whatever?
Spin Martin: cuz people have bills to pay
Subghoul Epsilon: free sims?
You: it's a nothing? $25,000 a year for them to run these 6 sims?
Cocoanut Koala: but - they can hire only so many, and will hire the
same few companies over and over
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. but once the ad runs.. and it makes it
press buzz.. who cares.. unless they really care about the space.. it
will vanish away anyway
You: Yes they are giving away fre land, 6 sims of free land
You: Rhiannon you aren't hearing this
You: no, they are different
Cocoanut Koala: we will be lucky if they allow us to continue to
create things, without having to buy a license or something
You: they are not the one-hit wonder of an AA or a Text 1000
Subghoul Epsilon: and are there SL ads inside the new GM cars?
Khanaar Ingmann: I personally, have no opposition for possible
employment making cars for GM, but as far as it goes, I work for
myself on my own.
You: they are here to "empower the community"
Khamon Fate: someone lives up the street from me that owns a
gardening business. you should see their yard. people are there
every day planting and trimming it's gorgeous. i sould never make
my yard look that good. i don't have the time or money for it.
You: I get scared when I hear about people "empowering" me
Rhiannon Chatnoir: no.. it will go open source before that Coco
You: that means they feel they have power to give to me and I'm
powerless
Fox Diller: You've got Khan here, making cars, for go knows how
long. Then GM comes in?
Spin Martin: hey can GM being here maybe fix sim crossing
problems?
You: but I'm not
Khamon Fate: but then, it's not what i do for a living. my yard
doesn't have to advertise for me
Cocoanut Koala: GM is going to empower us?
You: hahahaha SPin
You: well said
Fox Diller: That's right.
Spin Martin: well no it's a real question
Spin Martin: if they want the driving experience to be better
Khamon Fate: so i don't fault them always winning the best yard in
town plaque
Fox Diller: Their cars will suck on sim crossings just like the others.
Khanaar Ingmann: I've been making and selling vehicles for about a
year now.
Fox Diller: GM SL test dumies?
Spin Martin: but if they wanna throw money at fixing that
You: watch out when these big companies begin to take up
technical and political issues like sim crossing or telehubs or push
restrictions
Koz Farina: Advertars will take care of that - like ppl wearing
branded tshirts with logos
You: watch out!
Rhiannon Chatnoir: it is SPin.. and that is where if LL cares about
being seen as a valid space for those types of projects.. it might
Khamon Fate: i have my garden and am happing with it and life
goes on
You: if you think the voting machine is fixed and tweaked now,
look out!
ravagefox Savard: prok you're paranoid
You: Khamon you are too quietist
Fox Diller: lol
Spin Martin: this is not a democracy, this is a paid software
program
John Kew: so one question that comes to my mind is stock
You: we need to organize labour
Fox Diller: If I have a nickle everytime I heard that.
You: No Spin
You: it is a democracy
Spin Martin: well prior to open griefer registration
John Kew: will you be able to hold virtual stock in companies like
gm?
You: We must behave "as if" it is
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. one step up from an internet service
provider
Spin Martin: it is not
Fox Diller: d
You: I don't want to live inside a software company.
Spin Martin: well you are
You: I want to live in a country, not somebody's PR machine.
Spin Martin: i live here
Spin Martin: and in there
Fox Diller: Linden World, baby!
Spin Martin: and eve
Spin Martin: and warcraft
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I am more bothered we dont get account credit
for down time then if GM will do horrible things
You: Well someone else will make a better place then Spin and
we'll move there
Fox Diller: I won't.
Fox Diller: I love my Linden World.
Mobile Widget: open source?
June Cela: Prok, sum up what you think GM means to sl
Spin Martin: i want fracture! i want to shoot rock eating birds!
Cocoanut Koala: what did you mean, GM is empowering us?
You: I don't like WoW -- WoW is not a country, it's a game.
Khanaar Ingmann: with all this RL companies coming, probably
wont be long after taxes come after.
Subghoul Epsilon: open source is coming.....some day
Spin Martin: ha people sure treat it is
Rhiannon Chatnoir: li sl is working on making a opensource client
mobile
Spin Martin: people are working on open source stuff now
Spin Martin: because LL wont
Rhiannon Chatnoir: that as too mobile.. not saying it woudl be
mobile
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha
ravagefox Savard: how do you tax Second Life revenue?
You: Why do you all buy that open sourcery hype?
Spin Martin: that's the power of taking it into your own hands
Khamon Fate: prok, you're gonna live in a pr machine a long as the
world is suppoted by software.
Subghoul Epsilon: LL supposedly is
Oliphant Ming is Online
Rhiannon Chatnoir: oh prok
Spin Martin: because prok open source might mean you can run
the show your way yourself
You: No, the job of software is to engender suspension of disbelief
Spin Martin: waat no that's hollywood
Subghoul Epsilon: i buy into it because i work in network security,
and i've seen what open source has over closed time and time
again
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha
You: if I have to fend off invitations to after-parties from has-been
80s bands and warmed over aging dinosaur companies every day,
I can't suspend disbelief.
Spin Martin: if i have to think about proxy settings and i have a
preference pane
Spin Martin: it's software
Cocoanut Koala: you know, there IS always a goveernment,
whether you want to admit it or not, and a government type
You: Open source is one of those Marxist pipedreams. Somebody
has to pay the bills at some point.
You: Yes cooc
Fox Diller: Has anyone even figured out 'exactly' why GM wants
inside SL?
ravagefox Savard: most governments end up being aristocratic
You: It's either the Roman Empire or the Soviet Empire or the
Ottoman Empire
You: it's an empire all right
Fox Diller: Their word.
Spin Martin: yes and open source also exposes real talented
people who later get big paying jobs
Rhiannon Chatnoir: then you will continue on SL.. I bet it just
means there will be choices in the future on how you can come into
this space.. that is of course if all works out and it remains viable
Subghoul Epsilon: and they do pay. look at sourcefire
You: well let me try to find more on this
Spin Martin: hey plenty of people make closed platforms like the
ipod money
Cocoanut Koala: "SL: Our World, Your Labor!"
Spin Martin: so you dont have to be open source
Fox Diller: Maybe they wanna spearhead the car community, like
Khan here.
Spin Martin: i'm playing devils advocate
Khanaar Ingmann: which im actively worried about.
Koz Farina: and ppl get paid for using open source. to learn from
Fox Diller: Or, they want absolute brand marketing.
Subghoul Epsilon: i'm not saying LL HAS to goopen source, just
that there are corps making money on it
Fox Diller: GM is suffering from the GREEN Era, losing money
due to war and gas prices.
Cocoanut Koala: they are here for publicity, and to have
themselves some fun! and to be gods in the world!
Fox Diller: We gonna cut SL emmisions?
You: You know the MacArthur Foundation is giving $50 million to
study digital media including SL
You: will it get any critical study?
ravagefox Savard: heh
You: will it all be sycophantic?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: why dont you apply for a grant then
Subghoul Epsilon: depends on who runs the studies, right?
Khamon Fate: does anybody know if edward is building his
shakespeare worlds in SL?
Mobile Widget: could build the best future car in here
You: they have an open discussion started and they ask the
question: "How should digital media be controlled?" they start with
that assumption
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and.. i know it isnt all sycophantic
Subghoul Epsilon: i read that he hates SL
Mobile Widget: sustainability baby!
Fox Diller: I had a fight with a Canadian corp and won, because
they came into Second Life gleefully trying to say they were first.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: not in SL Khamon
Rhiannon Chatnoir: he is creating his own platform
You: then they say "What can you tell those overwhelmed by
technology" -- and I have to say that being in SL, I am
overwhelmed by technology.
Fox Diller: They're just brand marketing.
Cocoanut Koala: first what, fox?
Khamon Fate: good, perhaps that'll spark some competition.
where do we sign up for the beta?
Spin Martin: heh
Khamon Fate: i'll help test but probably won't want to play
Fox Diller: First Canadian corp inside SL.
Cocoanut Koala: oh
Fox Diller: I was like, LOL no.
You: http://media.gm.com/servlet/GatewayServlet?
target=http://image.emerald.gm.com/gmnews/viewpressreldetail.do
?domain=2&docid=29830
Rhiannon Chatnoir: he must have some sort of site.. maybe at his
univ or indiana.. isnt that where he is
You: full link to the Pontiac GM news
Fox Diller: Thanks Prok.
Subghoul Epsilon: better brush up on your iago quotes
Khamon Fate: first woodland sprite corps in sl too
John Kew: seriously, this is just a total market stunt by GM. I don't
see huge negative impacts from their presence, and maybe even a
working stock market with more big companies
Cocoanut Koala: stock market?
John Kew: if taht is the case, then it gives SL players the ability to
partly "own" said big companies
John Kew: why not?
You: “We envision weekly competitive driving events, drive-in
theaters playing car related films, machinima film studios, car-
themed fashion shows, live concerts, drive-in restaurants, you name
it. If an idea relates to any aspect of car culture, we intend to
Spin Martin: yeah no kidding
Khamon Fate: no john, these big spending marketing ploys don't
carry any weight in the world
Khamon Fate: they're over too quickly
You: Spin must be in on this
You: this one will Khamon
Spin Martin: i dont work for any studios prok
You: they will put the budget behind all that
June Cela: thanks Prok, for the headsup
Fox Diller: Hehe. :D
Fox Diller: Bad Spin, how could you. :/
Cocoanut Koala: aha, yes, they are providing the entertainment LL
would no longer subsidize
Fox Diller: lol
Khanaar Ingmann: From what i hear, Millionsofus have been
behind the Pontiac and Toyota jobs.
June Cela: see you all another time
You: well said Coco
Spin Martin: but will it help me of course, i'll post on it and give a
talk somewhere
You: and that's how it has to be
Cocoanut Koala: AND OMETHING TELLS ME THEY WILL
NOT BE CHARGING ADMISSION!
You: you can't expect a little California start-up to subsidize
people's games for ever
Khamon Fate: i dunno. does anyone remember who won the free
life accounts and year of free tier in the referral contests?
You: let GM subsidize their games
Cocoanut Koala: fiddle dee dee prok
Cocoanut Koala: TSO did it
Cocoanut Koala: still does it
Fox Diller: Pepsi in the Sims dude.
Cocoanut Koala: they cut the life out of the entertainment business
here
Koz Farina: i remeber when small guys got contracted by big
companies to build a web site for them. mor epower to em, i say
You: oh, it was right they did that
Spin Martin: ha i'm cool with pepsi cuz i dont care for coke
Spin Martin: hehe
Rhiannon Chatnoir: what Khamon
You: this will be better
Cocoanut Koala: and bunches of people said, "oh, well people will
CHARGE"
Fox Diller: Nice.
Spin Martin: who ever brings in red bull
Spin Martin: will be my hero
Khamon Fate: what khamon what?
Spin Martin: HERO
You: Additional partners helping execute the campaign are Second
Life developers Millions of Us ( Sausalito) and web developers
Domani Studios ( New York City)
Fox Diller: HEHE.
Fox Diller: Free Red Bull for Spin.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha.. k spin.. start writing up the RFP now
Koz Farina: then al went boom. but by then, the big companies had
learnt to build stuff themselves
Cocoanut Koala: that is why I'm not in entertainment here. I'm not
GM.
Spin Martin: i'm only in entertainment cuz it's portable everywhere
Khamon Fate: don't a lot of newbies still work in clubs and other
entertaining venues? or does it just seem that way?
You: Will there be anything left of our world in a year? or will we
be obliterated by car culture?
Spin Martin: there are clubs in SL?
Cocoanut Koala: there are
Spin Martin: heee
Fox Diller: What.
You: they do Khamon
You: but they long for real jobs
Cocoanut Koala: and everytime they try to do something to make it
pay, they get criticized
Koz Farina: some person sat in a corner cubicle in GM might end a
success in the company just becuase he or she nows how to build
in SL.
Fox Diller: How could car culture destroy SL?
You: look at the polls I have out, they all say the way to improve
new user experience is to have jobs
Fox Diller: Didn't I hear that Furries were supposed to have
destroyed SL?
Spin Martin: car culture will not destroy SL
Khamon Fate: well prok, i said that three years ago, and two, and
one
Koz Farina: has brand culture killed RL?
Fox Diller: :P
Cocoanut Koala: no, Koz, cause you have to already be in one of
the businesses, like Millions of Us or Electric Sheep
Khamon Fate: but the world's still here and going strong
Khanaar Ingmann: I will kill SL for being a furry car maker.
Fox Diller: lol
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you have your own polling firm now Prok?
Spin Martin: oh yeah furries are the problem ;)
Fox Diller: DAMN YOU KAHN! DAMN YOU.
Khanaar Ingmann: :p
Cocoanut Koala: i said about jobs when I first came in SL, and
everyone said I was stupid and just didn't get it
Koz Farina: Coco: I was aksed by Reuters a while ago to do their
rss stuff. i had no time so I tld them where to look
Spin Martin: some of my best starship commanders are furries
tyvm
Koz Farina: and I;m not a big co
Cocoanut Koala: that's good to hear, Koz!
You: No, I just put out voting machines, not a polling firm
Fox Diller: These companies, Anshe, Amiee, Avalon, RRR, blah,
blah, blah. All just wanna make shit pretty and offer lame solutions
to companies because SL is in the 'in' thing.
Khanaar Ingmann: Free with every car purchase, Fur on carpets :D
Spin Martin: and whatever they pay their rent
Rhiannon Chatnoir: that isnt totally inclusive then.. only a small
percentage .. a blip of opinions
Spin Martin: i want a lint roller company in SL
Cocoanut Koala: I am counting on a strong underground - those
ants Lordfly suggested that might survive it all
You: I was curious how Reuters found Barnes, whether LL steered
them or not.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: how bout a lint producing company
Fox Diller: God only knows the deals that happen behind our
backs.
Koz Farina: like the web - builf things you love buildiong and
sooner or later someone will one you to build one for them. GM
are good imho for offering a prize for a well designed SL vehicle
Rhiannon Chatnoir: pet lint balls
Fox Diller: Little whispers.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: much cuter than pet rocks
You: well Coco as I've often said, only the strict totalitarian cultures
like Gor will survive this gutting of indigenous culture by big
companies.
Koz Farina: someo will *pay you* to ...
Frans Charming: Reuters was done by ESC, i bet they contracted
barnes.
You: That's the sad thing.
Spin Martin: i have a pet dragon
Spin Martin: i can't wait until the first national dragon company---
oh wait nm
Koz Farina: DigiVox did the rss hud
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes.. they meay even spur some auto
innovation in SL
You: yes but how did Reuters get on to ESC?
You: They see Philip touting it in every single article.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: so it isnt just a one car town
Spin Martin: prok i get contacted by big companies
Spin Martin: i send em off
You: That's where there is no level field -- Philip saying over and
over again "ESC and MOU"
Frans Charming: Developers list, media attention?
Spin Martin: go talk to these people
You: he is their biggest booster
Spin Martin: they duke it out in proposals
You: it's not the developers list Frans
You: don't be silly
Koz Farina: Prok: i told reuters to try places like RiversRunRed,
MoM, and ESC
Fox Diller: I build only vialble solutions to companies.
You: you can't even locate that on the web site
You: it's Philip's endorsement of his beta friends, and word of
mouth among the kewl kids like Spin
Frans Charming: I neve rhad trouble finding it.
You: at the right conferences etc
You: its a normal process
You: what's abnormal however
Fox Diller: Spin is kewl?
Spin Martin: shhh
Koz Farina: word of mouth. exactly
Fox Diller: lol
You: is that these people aren't just starlets landing films in
Hollywood
Fox Diller: It's all word of mouth.
Spin Martin: i'm the bad guy cuz i'm like blogger fic podcast fic,
videoblog fic and mass media fic
Fox Diller: I just stuck my company on the dev list today.
Khamon Fate: d'ya really think pressure from GM is gonna make
LL fix border crossings? i think LL will just ignore their needs and
GM will end up WellsFargoing outta here
You: they control the very fiber of our world -- whether we have
telehubs, whether we have flexiprims or stability
Spin Martin: rumours has it, i develop them for a living, i'm trying to
convert prok ;)
You: THAT is my major beef about it -- they aren't just a business,
they are a political power
Koz Farina: pre web media used to be 'it's not what you know, it;s
who you know' - since the web (and v much her ein SL) I think its
a question of who you know AND what you can do
Fox Diller: I see your point Prok, now.
Khamon Fate: spin nis so cool i'm freezin over here
Spin Martin: hahaha
You: Flipper of ESC says only verified accounts should sell; that
would merely be his forums opinion
Spin Martin: hey kham speaking of
Koz Farina: in fact what you can DO BRINGS ppl to know
Spin Martin: you should go to my cyberpunk sim and see your
trrees everywhere
You: but as a huge economic force in ESC, he's in a p osition to
make that *happen*
You: just as he would wish it
Spin Martin: i dont make money on that sim btw we just stand
around and look all combat-y
Zed Night is Online
Koz Farina: lol
You: well like the car culture
You: the combat culture is all about the gear
Fox Diller: Are you saying we can't trust GM with the help of these
media studio's to build what's right for the grid, but only what they
might wish for their own political gain?
You: not the actual combat
Rhiannon Chatnoir: i never get invited over to combat.. sniff
You: it's boys' dress-up
Frans Charming: haha
Spin Martin: rhiannon, the doors open
Rhiannon Chatnoir: i know.. being silly
Spin Martin: Show Map > enter location >teleport
Khamon Fate: i will do that spin. worked on some technotrees
once but was never happy with them. i should dig them back out.
wish they'd left shiny alpha in play.
Spin Martin: ;)
Fox Diller: Suddenly the new sim "Gas is COOL" is opened?
Frans Charming: That's because you can't even walk a straight line
Rhia
Spin Martin: haha
Spin Martin: you WALK IN SL
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I am a neighbor of yours.. even if only a tiny
plot
Rhiannon Chatnoir: true Frans
Spin Martin: no i mean my other combat
Khanaar Ingmann: On the car culture aspect of stuff, I'm more of a
racing enthusiast, and offroad. big truck fan.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: almost 2 years in SL and i cant walk well at all
Spin Martin: the lag in jessie is killin me
Spin Martin: see truck culture in SL totally works
Spin Martin: i'm pro RL companies but they also dont affect every
second of my day
Khanaar Ingmann: What SL needs is a good offroad/rock climbing
area.
You: Spin lag is spiking every 20 minutes
Aleksandr Martov is Offline
You: 1:20, 1:40 etc
You: on every sim
Khamon Fate: virtual worlds will always be monarchial though.
we'll always be beholden to whoever hosts the environment.
Spin Martin: yeah
You: all the time
You: I've bene tracking this
You: it's like the thing is saving?
You: and when it goes into the save? it lags out
Khamon Fate: the only politics that come into play are paying for
the software development and hardware
Spin Martin: anyway, most of these RL companies dont affect me
just chillin or shooting things
Spin Martin: i can see in some spaces sure
Spin Martin: but yeah it's too big now
Spin Martin: you think it's bad with them
ravagefox Savard: heh
Spin Martin: wait till there are like 25 anshes
Fox Diller: Ew.
Spin Martin: and 25 proks
Fox Diller: Not enough rice.
Khamon Fate: makes it easy really, oligarchys are the easiest govt's
to work with in terms of using the system to effect change
Spin Martin: and 25 adams
Khanaar Ingmann: ouch.
You: Spin, how do you pay for your 4.5 sims?
Fox Diller: Not enough politics.
Spin Martin: my own pocket
Khanaar Ingmann: rice?
You: I gather it's not by returning prims and putting out prefabs?
Spin Martin: might pick up spare cash
You: but your own pocket comes from...?
You: your RL jobs with clients?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: his RL job
You: who are related?
You: no?
Spin Martin: i have a job, i do a ton of things in RL
Spin Martin: starting to get into more SL stuff
You: so you have essentially a PR dept.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: Prok.. how id you pay for land initialy
You: like GM
Rhiannon Chatnoir: your own RL money
Rhiannon Chatnoir: that is a silly question
You: that can call this "server storage space"
Spin Martin: my RL job isn't SL related
Rhiannon Chatnoir: if we all had to wait around till we wearned the
SL money to won things.. the grid would be sooo small
Koz Farina: will ppl look back at these discussioon texts and treat
it like the old greek philisophical or political historical discussions?
You: I paid for it by selling my avatar from TSO on ebay, then
selling my first land here.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: own
ravagefox Savard: i rent vendor space
You: little by little
Fox Diller: Look.
Fox Diller: I started with nothing.
Spin Martin: i give some vendor space to people i like, but i'm not
a mall
Fox Diller: Zero.
Lillia Lehane is Offline
Fox Diller: Now, I've done things in SL that I could only imagine in
SL.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and.. how did you pay for your TSO account
fees
Khamon Fate shouts: spin is NOT a mall
Koz Farina: i bought land. learnt on it. not sell a product. I still
havemt broken even,
Koz Farina: now* not not
Doctoe Schnook: you are a self selecting mall
Spin Martin: i just started buildign
Rhiannon Chatnoir: the money has an origin that undoubtably goes
back to RL
Spin Martin: and wont build for people
You: TSO is only 9.95 for 3 avatars
You: you can build up their skills and rares, hawk them for $150
US on ebay then
You: or you could back then
Khamon Fate: ha ha ha i built for six months before i learned how
to use camera angles
Frans Charming: But Prok, i could few those profits as RL
earnings.
Khamon Fate: what a chore
Rhiannon Chatnoir: so it doesnt make sense to knock someone for
having or wanting to put more RL $ resources into here
Frans Charming: you sold on ebay.
Spin Martin: do i want to ttry and build a product placement
service that's non offensive, sure
Spin Martin: but i do this stuff cuz i like it
Frans Charming: it is unrelated to sl.
Spin Martin: there's no need to own most of Jessie
Spin Martin: the army could come in
Spin Martin: set up a combat sim
Spin Martin: it's still not jessie
Spin Martin: and jessie has more importance than any army
Fox Diller: Exactly.
Spin Martin: the US army can't beat me
Spin Martin: and can't beat that history
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and god knows what you payed for wanting to
own jessie
Fox Diller: Just like TV companies can't touch me.
Spin Martin: yeah dont ask
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I respect your craziness for that
Khamon Fate: and it would be a collasal waste of taxpayer's
dollars for the ARMY to set up combat sims in this cartoony
environment
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yet.. you arent crying devaluted real estate
You: don't bet on it Khamon
Frans Charming: haha
You: they'll be here before too long too
Spin Martin: dude they totally would
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you would never in a million years get back for
jessie what you spent for it
Doctoe Schnook: in the uk product placement on TV is illegal -
what happens when people are doing TV-like stuff in places like
SL?
Fox Diller: Why not bring engineering firms, think thanks, non-
profit orgs in here?
You: Rhiannon, that's just it -- devaluation of land
Spin Martin: nope i realize that
You: even with labour
You: that's the hole in the world
Frans Charming: The army pays for the game devv and mulitplayer
services already.
You: the rent in the fabric
Khamon Fate: it's a waste of money for GM to do anything here
except for the fact that it gets them a lot of real world press
You: that GM rips further
Doctoe Schnook: i am from a think tank and am trying to get us in
here
Khanaar Ingmann: i've been standing here for 90 minutes.
Fox Diller: Doctoe, can I IM you?
You: Koz what's up with this privileged beta thing ofyours?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha
Doctoe Schnook: yip
Khamon Fate: i'm willing to bet that's their only interest in this
world platform thingy
You: why didn't you just open it to the public?
You: I am definitely not getting that
Spin Martin: it is
Spin Martin: you can get a free one
You: why have only a handful of people blog from the beta
Koz Farina: Prok: what priv beta?
You: but originally he had a beta that was privileged
Koz Farina: Its open now
You: you had to IM you
Spin Martin: that's how software works
You: Koz, I'm takling about BEFORE
You: for MONTHS
You: WHY???
You: what was UP with that
You: not NOW
Khamon Fate: whachutalkinbout koz?
Doctoe Schnook: that is what beta implies though
Koz Farina: not priv at all. I asked you if you wanted one too
Khamon Fate: what beta?
Spin Martin: cuz it's BETA and it could BREAK
Rhiannon Chatnoir: yes... biggest difference is just being able to
connecting it to other blogs
Rhiannon Chatnoir: he had testers.. just had to ask him
You: only after weeks and weeks when I nagged about it
Spin Martin: you dont want a million broken things out there
Spin Martin: so you start small
Rhiannon Chatnoir: no big thing
Koz Farina: cos I think youre a great blogger
You: and what kind of beta is closed like that?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: not his fault you didnt ask
Spin Martin: most web software
Doctoe Schnook: just a controlled environmnet for product testing
Doctoe Schnook: not an elite one
Spin Martin: sure
You: um I did ask
You: over and over
You: and was ignored
Spin Martin: that's old as the hills prok
Spin Martin: you didn't say please
Koz Farina: lots of pl IMMed me to ask to try it. I gave them one.
simple as that
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ee gads
You: becuase he wished to have a special list carve out the blog
Huding market first : )
Doctoe Schnook: he ignores me all the time and i am in the same
room
You: Koz I did ask y ou over and over
You: you ignored me
Spin Martin: haha
Koz Farina: did you?
You: I even openly asked the question on blogs
Khamon Fate: khamon is going to watch dr. who ~ spin you got a
landmark for your cyberpunk sim?
Spin Martin: aww doctoe
You: in comments
You: absolutely
You: maybe your messages cap?
Khamon Fate: thanks for the invite prok
Koz Farina: oh I;m sorry Pork. I really didnt see the q...
Fox Diller: Why does it always go around to how Prok never got
something, and so we meet up and argue about it.
Koz Farina: ya want one?
Spin Martin: prok you should ask me next time
Doctoe Schnook: pork hehehe
You: Fox, he did not make it open to the public.
You: That is a fact
Spin Martin: i just call him in the middle of the night
Mobile Widget: new Dr Who?
Fox Diller: TRue.
You: you had to beg to get attention
Khamon Fate: i never got a prok either
You: that is wrong
Rhiannon Chatnoir: you are one of those conversationalists that is
soo hard to deal with.. take the subject ina fevered pitch then if it
isnt working.. pick on someone.. and then maybe wait and lunge
back in again back to before
Khamon Fate: new ones yes
Mobile Widget: ooo
Fox Diller: I'm privy to stuff in SL that I can't talk about.
You: no, I just wanted an answer on this little point
Koz Farina: prok: i had a public site and rss feed all the way and
my nameto IM
Fox Diller: Bigwhoop.
You: since he never answered my repeated IMs
You: *shurgs*
Khamon Fate: trying to catch up. i just barely saw sarah jane last
week
Khamon Fate: see y'all
You: I indeed wrote to you
You: and that shouldn't have to happen
Mobile Widget: heh have fun!
Spin Martin: ciao kham
Fox Diller: d
Khanaar Ingmann: adios.
You: it should be something you click and get inworld
You: without all the fuss
Koz Farina: Prok: oszza. I gotan IM about you saying this smae
Question. that was the forst
Frans Charming: bye khamon
Doctoe Schnook: you can
Doctoe Schnook: get it inworld
You: but that is NOW
Koz Farina: I get lots IMs from my test ogjects. it can get capped I
suppose.
You: I'm talking about THEN
You: anyway never mind
You: you don't get it
Rhiannon Chatnoir: between IM caps and RL business.. I am sure
most of us dont answer every IM we get.. or see them
Koz Farina: Prok, if had seen it I would have rushed to giveu one, i
promise ;)
Koz Farina: i get what your saying.
You: Koz, why the closed beta?
You: why?
Koz Farina: but I had a site and an rss feed - i blogged about it.
Fox Diller: Beta of what?
Koz Farina: i didnt ignore ya ;)
You: his Hud thing
Koz Farina: bloghud.com
Fox Diller: Hud thing?
You: why not just put it out in world?
Koz Farina: there IS now.
You: and it's understood, it is beta, it busts
You: like the 411 guy
Rhiannon Chatnoir: oh my.. does it matter.. want me to buy you
one Prok
You: like anybody who makes stuff
Koz Farina: a free one!
You: open betas
Koz Farina: sheesh.
You: why closed?
Spin Martin: some people choose to release open beta
Spin Martin: some choose closed
You: no, I want to understand what is up
Spin Martin: i like to ship software that's out of beta
You: and I think what is up
Spin Martin: but that's why i'm not web 2.0 tekkie
Koz Farina: even the one that ppl pay for is cheap compared to
what ppl pay for a necklace in this place
You: is that he wants YOU to create the face and the market of it
You: not ME
You: get it?
You: lol
Doctoe Schnook: you might as well not be beta if you want to
open up
Fox Diller: Ask Spin.
Fox Diller: I created a SL blogging system.
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ha.. yes asecond ago you lamented that LL is
making you pay for a beta.. but now you want Koz's beta like no
tommorrow
Doctoe Schnook: completely
Khanaar Ingmann: So... what is the topic of conversation now?
Spin Martin: it's not really a blog thing
You: I didn't lament that at all.
Koz Farina: thats the wen2.0 problem. open beta. but any one can
apply.
Spin Martin: i think it's more replacing the picks from inworld and
getting em to the web so everyone can see em
You: I said we had hardships in beta, and were not given the
MEDIA hyping and steerage that LL gives these companies now
You: they don't appear at OUR pressers duh
You: that's all
Koz Farina: i;m sorry I missed previous requiest prok, but I replied
aksing if you wanted one and didnt hear back. here.. :)
You: it's about the hype
Rhiannon Chatnoir: I had funny timing.. I asked Koz for a copy of
it.. and got one a couple of days before it was out anyway.. just hd
to ask though
You: I asked Rhiannon
Fox Diller: Yeah.
You: how many times do I have to repeat the same damn thing?
Spin Martin: 34
You: you can't admit the point here
Fox Diller: A lot, it seems.
You: that there isn't a willingness to open things up beyond your
little cliques
You: so maybe GM is write to make you all road kill
You: honestly
Spin Martin: i know koz in RL, he's not the cliqueish type
You: I wonder if it comes to that
You: ok then why the closed beta?
You: ?
You: seriosly
Fox Diller: Why does it matter?
You: why?
Fox Diller: Seriously?
Koz Farina: Prok. It. Want. CLosed.
Koz Farina: wasnt
You: because it's the root of the issue
Fox Diller: What issue?
Koz Farina: and even if it was. so what?
You: Koz, on your blog, it says
Koz Farina: companies do that?
You: "i will have it for everyone ELSE real soon"
You: why?
You: we can demand accountability
Spin Martin: you release something by invite so you can keep track
of early usage
Fox Diller: Like my iTunes software.
Spin Martin: by releasing a product as open beta it's like supporting
a full on product
You: Spin, you create branding and have people you like to control
the look that's all
Spin Martin: if you have a full on product that take away from
getting it out of beta
Fox Diller: I can track people easily.
You: that's what I'm trying to get him to fess up to
Koz Farina: cos it was a beta. and I wnated to make sure it
worked with a controlled amount of ppl first b4 releasing it on
potentially thousands before fixing it
Rhiannon Chatnoir: ok.. the cyclical convo is maddening.. I am
going to wander
You: rather than spouting "just because"
Frans Charming: Prok, why ask the question, if you only accept
your own answer, we hve done this 3 time snow
Spin Martin: ha
Rhiannon Chatnoir: hugs to you Koz... bear with it
Koz Farina: do you think i want to spend all day replying to help ?
:)
Spin Martin: hehe
You: Koz, you are a clique?
You: that's all
Koz Farina: so I work at it to refine it
Koz Farina: and now it is open...
Khanaar Ingmann: I might as well be off too... since this discussion
is straying way off topic
You: That isn't wrong; just don't pretend it's otherwise?
You: Yeah I'm done
Koz Farina: oooo.. youre right.. there text on the main site at the
bottonm is out of date
You: : )
You: yes Koz
Spin Martin: so what GM won't affect your biz, is that the summary
You: but how else am I suppose to know?
Koz Farina: apols
You: I read that daily
You: thinking is it ready yet? is it rady yet?
Rhiannon Chatnoir: night all... take care
You: because i'm not your ddrinking or cyber buddy duh
Spin Martin: nini rhia
You: I'm just part of the unwashed public
Rhiannon Chatnoir: and make sure to save me rides in your GM
cars
You: do you get it now?
Spin Martin: why are cliques this new new thing
You: couple that with me asking twice or so in IMs and getting no
answers
Koz Farina: yes. my info is bad.
Spin Martin: anyone here been to high school?
Spin Martin: or law school
You: I cnoclude: this is for Spin Martin; not for mere mortals
Doctoe Schnook: i consider this whole group a clique
Spin Martin: or um
Spin Martin: oh wait
Spin Martin: life = cliques
Doctoe Schnook: and i feel like a total outsider
Mobile Widget: take care Rhia
Doctoe Schnook: i find so much of SL exclusionary
Koz Farina: i'll attach the hammer headsmack object now :)
You: It is
Koz Farina: and fix it
Fox Diller: Khan.
Fox Diller: Question.
Koz Farina: well spotted Pork! You wim a free blogHUD PRO -
comin right atcha!
Spin Martin: my friends and i dont go to casinos is that bad
Fox Diller: I'll do any scripting you want, for company cars?
Fox Diller: plz.
Koz Farina gave you blogHUDPRO 1.03.
You: thanks!
Spin Martin: khanaar has me covered
Koz Farina: np
Koz Farina goes off to fix the site text ;)
Khanaar Ingmann: Fox, give me a moment
Fox Diller: Sure.
Fox Diller waits.
Frans Charming: Ok, take care people. I'm off. It was interresting.
Spin Martin: later frans
Fox Diller: Bye Frans.
Mobile Widget: have a great night/day all! good stuff.
Scope Cleaver: Later Frans
Doctoe Schnook: bye frans
Mobile Widget: see ya racin on the sims
Spin Martin: dude i wanna go race now
Mobile Widget: hey - new sims to practice in in the (furthest)
southern mainland
Spin Martin: noice
Khanaar Ingmann: Fox, Company cars?
Fox Diller: Yeah.
Fox Diller: For me company.
I visited this blog first time and found it very interesting and informative.. Keep up the good work thanks..
Posted by: Van Sales | July 04, 2009 at 02:35 AM