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« New Potion at St. Thaddeus -- Rid Wrong Hands! | Main | AnneMarie Otoole, Maker of Scourgemobiles, on 3-Day Hiatus from SL »

September 25, 2011

Comments

Prokofy Neva

[9:08] Tameiki Pawpad: (Saved Sun Sep 25 03:23:07 2011) Okay, I don't know who you think you are, but if you're gonna associate me for being a group of 3000+ who like MLP just because the ex-group leader was Twizzer, then you have another think coming. You honestly think that a majority of that group even knew? You have to be a sick, paranoid old man to even assume that. so, here's my introduction: I'm Tameiki Pawpad. I'm a musician, and I have a long history of DJing on SL. I've worked at WFA/COR, Mists of Erusia, and FYC. in IRL, my name is Joel Brickman. I'm [RL info removed]. I love to create music, and I mostly make electronic music. I'm also a DJ in real life. I graduated from Muncie Central High School in 08'. My Myspace band page is linked in my profile, and from there you should be able to find my personal Facebook page, which I gladly keep public. I never met Twizzer, never seen Twizzer, and never heard of Twizzer. If you're gonna associate me with a griefer because im in a MLP fan group, then you can fuck off :)
[9:09] Prokofy Neva: No, if you're going to associate with a group founded by a griefer, *you* can fuck off. I'm not required to rent to people about whom I have grounds to believe they will disrupt my community and use group powers to harass others. There's plenty of other places to rent in SL. Find them.
[9:09] Second Life: User not online - message will be stored and delivered later.
[9:11] Prokofy Neva: It's not about paranoia, it's about common sense. The hallmark of griefers is constantly pretending they aren't really doing what they do. Bronies have their own sims and areas, so to come out and rent the very parcel that has been repeatedly griefed by TWH begs the question. If you're innocent, you can be happy somewhere else, but I have no way of knowing that, and too many things don't add up -- or in fact, do add up.
[9:11] Second Life: User not online - message will be stored and delivered later.
[9:11] Prokofy Neva: You shouldn't be giving out RL information and location in SL, there are many ill-intentioned people.
[9:11] Second Life: User not online - message will be stored and delivered later.

Prokofy Neva

In other words -- the usual knee-jerk lefty response to this sort of situation, in RL and SL, is to say, OMGODZORS you're violating civil rights, you're guilty of guilt by association, you're willing to tar an entire group of 3,000 people with the same brush of a few briefers, you're willing to make horrible security states -- blah blah blah.

Um, no. It's pretty simple. Turn it around. Why do you have a griefer -- a notorious, multiple permabanned horrendous griefer -- as you group founder? Once that becomes clear, and you see the havoc and misery this person and their groups have caused, you get a new leader and make a new group.

No group of 3,000 in SL has really 3,000 *active* members. Half the time they're members because they were spammed with automatic group joiners when they landed on a sim, or they couldn't get the freebies without joining the group.

So don't cry to me about how you will lose customers if you revise your group -- if they are loyal and active, they will be happy to disassociate with griefers and follow you.

YOU have to realize that by making common cause with people who harm others and cause them loss of time and money, *your* business will be harmed too -- and stop the association. It's that simple.

This reminds me so much of the dynamics of Bolshevism and Communism and the Cold War -- and it's no accident, comrade. Um, duh, I get the different in scale and magnitude, but the *dynamics* are the same.

Many lefties and liberals tune into the whole Soviet-US thing of the Cold War in the late 1950s. It's as if they are deaf and blind to the Leninist and Stalinist terror starting in the 1920s, reaching an apex in 1937, and continuing until the 20th Party Congress in 1956, but in fact persisting long after for another 30 years at least in some forms.

It's as if the mass murder of millions, the cruel torture and imprisonment and deaths of people in the USSR, just doesn't register. They can't seem to grasp that if 57 million people are slaughtered from forced state famines, political imprisonment, work camps, and death marches, then the proper attitude to that regime is one of chillyness -- and a Cold War is just what the doctor ordered if you don't think you can militarily defeat them. It's more than fine. In fact, it's what deters and contains and ultimately ends such a menace.

But many young people missed all this, or didn't want to read it, so they tune in later in the 1960s or 1980s even, and gasp, but isn't that awful, all these nuclear weapons pointed at these perfectly cheerful people who do nothing but dance and drink vodka and make little nesting dolls. And so on. So they blast the west for their anti-communism, and say nary a word about decades of crimes against humanity because they either don't know, or don't want to know, or their minds can't grasp the enormity of it.

In the same way -- only in comic form and in miniature, of course -- the entire griefer thing occurs. The griefers harass and heckle and bully, they crash sims, they make crude sexual attacks, they spew obscene and racist particles and textures -- and it's as if it is all off stage, invisible. Fellow-travellers like Artemis who know better claim they never see it. Witless types like Elysium Hynes claim that they never see it and they think it's exaggerated or that someone like me "attracts" it. But all I ever did *was write it down and publish it*. And that's what you do to fight nihilism and cynicism of this sort -- record and expose, relentlessly. It works.

It's like the Russian wit is saying now about Putin becoming president again: "History occurs first as tragedy, then as comedy, then a few more times for the really ignorant."

The Bronies people seem to be playing dumb in part over the Twizzle/Tizzers thing, judging from the chatlogs at the JLU wiki, but they lost two sims in this. You would think that would concentrate their little pony minds wonderfully, and they'd regroup.

No one from the Tizzers-founded Bronies is going to be renting from me. I did this with certain Emerald Dev groups, until the message become stark: if you stay in a group that harms your landlord, then you can't rent here. Full stop.

I don't care if there are "3,000 customers I've lost". Because the reality is, there aren't any 3,000 customers, and the 300-600 that might really be lost are worth losing for the sake of not letting in griefers that then make a dozen long-time renters leave because they're griefed. A tenant in hand is worth two on the pony.

If you have a problem with this and think you're horribly discriminated against, I can only say: fuck off. Leave your griefer-founded groups. Get a new hobby. Lobby to get your little ponies to regroup and rebrand. That's it.

Tameiki Pawpad

>[9:11] Prokofy Neva: You shouldn't be giving out RL information and location in SL, there are many ill-intentioned people.

And I see you are the perfect example in this case. :) Unlike you, however, I don't see everyone as evil scum of the world. I host my RL location freely because I do shows and I welcome anyone to join. Announcements are both posted on my Myspace and my Facebook. You should come if you're in the East-Central Indiana area!

Thanks for posting these logs. Unfortunately, they are having an opposite effect from what you originally attended. It really is quite sad actually. Do you realise how crazy, obsessed, and paranoid these logs make you appear? Or is logic and reason something that is truly non-existent to you?

Prokofy Neva

Um, I'm not crazy or obsessed, dear, and uh, no, I don't expect to be in the greater Indiana area...ever.

I don't care what your story is, it's up to me to make judgements about who I accept to give permissions in my group.

It's not a big deal, it takes a few minutes of my time, and SL is a big place and you can go back to your little ponies. Your need to rent *right on the sim that is always griefed* from a group that is headed by a long-time destructive griefer isn't my problem, and it's not a sign of "paranoia" or "crazyness" to put two and two together and deny you access. End of story.

Logic and reason in fact suggest that if somebody comes all the way to an old Mainland sim to the exact parcel that was just griefed with dead cats and banning of me on my own land, and comes from a group founded by Twizzers, and also makes three payments -- one of them an odd number -- within 5 minutes -- and also makes flippant remarks when asked questions -- that they are trying to annoy me.

I'm not available to be annoyed *shrugs*. Go ride your ponies elsewhere.

Tameiki Pawpad

It's quite amusing to watch you pitifully attempt to justify your actions. You ACTUALLY believe that an entire community of My Little Pony fans are out to get you! *laughs*

I've never seen you or talked to you before. I've never been on your sim before. But I give you my permission to believe otherwise. It only hurts your own image when you attack potential customers under false accusations. :)

Prokofy Neva

What's amusing is *your* asshole arrogance, big guy. I don't believe anybody is "out to get me". I believe a few people in a group that can't possibly have that many active members are trying to snow others, justify griefing, and make exaggerated judgements to aggrandize themselves. Perhaps it makes you feel special and "empowered" to imagine someone is "frightened" of your, um, little ponies.

My accusations aren't false. You are in a group, founded by a griefer. You need to hear that, and address it. If you attitude is "I don't care, I don't even know that person," well, too bad. You don't get to not care when I come in the picture because I will make you aware by refunding and evicting you to help concentrate your little pony mind wonderfully. If it isn't concentrating wonderfully and you need to keep huffing and puffing, you only discredit yourself.

My Little Ponies -- um, YOUR Little Ponies -- are toxic and polluted now in SL because of the Woodbury Infiltration. And you need to hear that, and the managers of this group need to hear that. If they want to go on pretending to know nothing, they can do that, but until they renounce those who have harmed others and reform that group without Tizzers and other permabannd alts, they won't have a good reputation. They don't have one now, and you're adding to its tarnish by blustering and imagining that you've somehow "hurt my image".

Tameiki Pawpad

*laughs* Now you're actually questioning if the 3000 number is real! I haven't been on the Brony sims in a while, but last I saw, they didn't have an group inviter. But let's say they do--and they probably do--because you do bring up a good point. What if a majority of that number joined because of the automatic group invite? Does that still make them guilty? Yup, according to you! Doesn't matter if they recently join, without any knowledge for the history of the group. They're still guilty because they're IN it and that's what matters! And you're calling me arrogent? :)

Go on, respond, because you're only digging a hole for yourself. :)

Tameiki Pawpad

Oh, and let's get something straight. I don't think I'M ruining your image, I think YOU'RE ruining your image. :)

Sorry for the double post, I'm not sure if I can edit comments.

Prokofy Neva

You're still here Tameiki? Why? Don't you have an, um, fascinating life as a DJ to attend to in inner Indiana?

I really don't give a good goddamn what some "3,000 people" think of me. If they are such dumbasses that they can join a group of a permabanned notorious griefer thrive removed from SL and not care about it, if they have no decency or morals, even being supposedly cute little ponies, than fuck them.

Indeed, if they are apprised of this situation -- and they have been -- they should disassociate themselves. If I were in a group of 3,000, and I found the owner was a permabanned alt, I'd likely leave myself. I wouldn't ask tenants to join a group of some early account I had in SL that had founded a group, and then had to be retired because there's a limit on the number of accounts you can have. I'd make a new group. This is just basic decency -- you shouldn't have to join a group where the owner is somehow missing or a puzzle. What kind of business is that?!

YOU sure have knowledge of the history of the group, and this isn't a discussion of "3,000 people who didn't know" but YOU. I don't have 3,000 little bronies trying to rent the frequently-griefed Furness, there is only YOU, and you sure as hell know the score, and indeed may even be one of the Woodburies on an alt, just because you are a DJ doesn't mean anything.

No, you're digging your hole here, because you can't do the simple, moral, and legal thing here: disown and disclaim a notorious griefer. Instead, you'd rather yammer on endlessly about "your rights" and your supposed entitlements and try to make it look like *my* problem.

Griefers are the problem; not me. Groups founded by griefers whose later members can't repudiate them are the problem; not me. You are the problem; not me. Hence, you get a refund, and you go on your way. Bye!

Tameiki Pawpad

When did I ever associate myself with griefers? The Bronies staff frowned upon such actions, and Curly Fride even BOOTED people out of the group and out of the sim who participated in these activities. The Bronies group is a PG rated group and it's HEAVILY enforced as that. I have knowledge and history of the group up to the point I joined it. This was around version 0.3 of Curly Fride's avatar. You assume again that I had knowledge of Tizzer's past, which I didn't. You know why I joined the group? Because I love the show and I thought the avatar looked awesome.

You assume again that I didn't disown Tizzer. I do. Staff put a heavy amount of blame onto Curly Fride. After Tizzer's account was locked, Curly took ownership of the group. However, we were told that it was a malicious take over. I still don't even know if this is true or not. We were also told that bill for the sim was never paid and this is why Linden Labs took the sim off the grid. I know this is not true. We were lied to by Tizzer, and that is what I disown.

But we have a new owner, new sim, and new staff. The group has moved on and so have I. As I've said before, I'm not active with them. I've only popped into the new sim to check out the shops there, but I haven't been back since. In fact, the only reason I stayed isfor the freebies that are released in notices and for updates on Curly's avatars.

Curly Fride was the reason I joined and the only reason I'm still a member.

You can assume all you want, but that doesn't make it anymore true. I was never a problem, because you don't know who I am. YOU attacked ME. I held no malicious intent. The only thing you can do is hang upon your conspiracy theories that no sane mind, and no mature person, would so desperately grasp upon.

Prokofy Neva

Tameiki, your continued ranting here only invites further suspicions that you are involved in the usual elaborate troll.

But even if you aren't, so what? You've only dug deeper! You now admit that you knew that you were lied to by Tizzer -- except you're getting your story mixed up, first saying you didn't know, then saying you realized you were lied to. Yet you remained in the group. Curly Fride could have formed another group. It costs $100. A slightly different name, and he is free of this problem forever. Breaking the group-think gang-colours identity of groups is key to restraining griefers. So you definitely have to start there. Tizzers doesn't get to keep dining out on the Bronies name, and polluting and infiltrating the group with the usual griefer agenda.

If you're not active with this group, you can leave it. The fact that you cling to it and demand its identity lets us know that in fact you are not willing to disassociate with griefer (you wouldn't *have* to get the freebies and updates *only* this way, you could ask the guy and explain to him that his group is discredited and he should put a dispenser inworld or start another group).

You -- and others -- need to burn it in. If you associate with these people who have caused years of harassment and destruction on the grid, you can't rent with me. And likely, some others of principle, either. So you will be changing on this, not me -- or not. I will not rent to people with the Bronies group founded by Twizzle/Tizzer -- full stop.

I don't care how you view this -- there's no hysteria or paranoia or crazyiness involved, it's just very clear and simple and normal valuation: I don't help griefer groups, full stop. Not when they have fucked me over as much as they have.

Ultimately, if you were to go to the Lindens and say that you need to have a different group owner now that the original was permabanned, I'm sure they'd oblige.

Finally, I didn't "attack" you. I refused you a service -- which is my right for any reason or no reason -- because you are associated with a malicious group that has harmed me and my tenants repeatedly, as recently as this last week. So you don't get to keep ranting and raving about your "rights" -- you have none, when it comes to my decision about my property and who I will rent it to.

There's a million rentals in Second Life, and your continued grandstanding here is merely an elaborate form of trolling in bad faith.

Again, it's not about "conspiracy". It's about facts and sober analysis. Founder of group: permabanned griefer. Tenant paying three odd amounts, like a griefer. Tenant migrating directly to a parcel just griefed with dead cats and bans. Even if those facts don't converge on an actual alt of Tizzers or some actual plot, it is merely prudent under those circumstances to tell the person to move on.

Bye.

Siana Gearz

I'm confused. What does this all tell us, if anything at all?

Gisele

Tell me Tameiki/Tizzers, why does your kind like to play furries and female avatars? Do you think if you play females or cutesy animals and pretend to like ponies (what a crock) that it will add to the plausible deniabilty angle which most griefers seem to be obsessed with? Is this the grade-school level logic behind this trend?

You're seriously obsessed with Prokofy. See a shrink and limit your time on the net, it's rotting your brain. Or, continue to waste your life, compensating for your RL failures via portraying a creepy asshole online (and apparently in RL as well-- like when you went "trick-or-treating" at Kalel's).

Don't you think it's about time to grow up?

goodness me

prok... hot damn woman you are a mess. I feel bad for your psychiatrist...

Arabella Steadham

Geez, Prok, you are f*cking obnoxious. And why do you bring all this up in the first place? I feel so sorry for you...

Brache Spyker

Proky is so hilarious whenever the blog comes up in a random search for whatever I was looking for I stop and laugh obsessively at what's going on in it- especially the off-topic rants- and wonder why anyone even gives Proky business. All they need to do is come here and read a few chat logs and realize there are far saner business people to deal with, though I won't bother naming any since I'd hate to see them associated with you.

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